Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

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Smokey20
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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by Smokey20 » 2019-02-16, 22:55

mrnhmath wrote:
mrtoo wrote: uBlock Origin
Latest "legacy" version can be found here. Ideally you should use native adblockers like ABPrime or Adblock Latitude instead.
mrtoo wrote: Privacy Badger
Redundant with uBlock.
Privacy Badger is NOT redundant to uBlock Origin. I was using both on Basilisk and use both on all other browsers for a long time now. They get different things. Plus, Privacy Badger now learns actively.

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by Smokey20 » 2019-02-16, 23:02

mrtoo wrote:Well this really sucks. I updated Basilisks today and lost all my addons. I go to the PaleMoon site and the few addons I want are not compatible. The addons I want the most are the following:

uBlock Origin
HTTPS Everywhere
Cookie AutoDelete
Privacy Badger
Decentraleyes
CanvasBlocker
Open in VLC media player
User-Agent Switcher
Flagfox

So should I hang around Basilisk or start searching for a new browser?
User-Agent Switcher 0.7.3.1 works on the latest version of Basilisk. Perhaps, you are having trouble importing the list or another problem with it?

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by coffeebreak » 2019-02-17, 00:54

Smokey20 wrote:User-Agent Switcher 0.7.3.1 works on the latest version of Basilisk. Perhaps, you are having trouble importing the list or another problem with it?

I think mrtoo may have been using one of the webextension forks of User Agent Switcher, of which there are a couple.

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by markz » 2019-02-17, 22:54

First of all, a heap of gratitude for the last browser available that runs several of my long time favorite Firefox extensions that no longer run in Firefox!!!!
These are Chickenfoot which I don't use much any more as I can do most things in TamperMonkey, http://up.csail.mit.edu/chickenfoot/
and DownThemAll! which I use every day. Is there a good password manager for Basilisk I can easily export my LassPass vault to?
That's the only one requiring WebExtension support that I miss. I can live with the built in password manager, but it will reduce the number of sites I visit with Basilisk.

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Sampei Nihira
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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by Sampei Nihira » 2019-02-18, 08:58

CanvasBlocker Legacy has many bugs.
It is impossible to use unless you disable it on problematic websites.

Cookie Autodelete may not be necessary.
Read the guide below:

https://restoreprivacy.com/firefox-privacy/

I would recommend instead the installation of:

No Resource URI Leak:

https://wiki.hyperbola.info/doku.php?id ... uxp_addons

Test:

https://browserleaks.com/firefox

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by DeathNACan » 2019-02-18, 16:08

Let me begin by saying I don't mean to sound like an insensitive end user so please don't take this posting that way. I understand your reasoning behind discontinuing WebExtension support and I wonder if you could put the option for the end user to turn it back on? Here is my reasoning... according to Mozilla, the move to WebExtenions was primarily motivated by the need for enhanced security. My personal opinion is that Mozilla seems to agree with Microsoft's view that the less the user can do to customize his computing experience, the more secure the computer will be. It reeks of a, "We Know Best; You Really Don't Need To Be Able To Do That!" mentality. Unfortunately, the problem is this... I use security add-ons like Ublock Origin, , Flash Control, JavaScript Toggle On and Off to protect my browser, want to be able to customize my browser and the move to WebExtensions means that developers are no longer updating in the older format. To make matters worse, Mozilla recently removed the entire archive of non-WebExtenstion add-ons from their site making finding them on the web at best very difficult and in most case impossible. Luckily, I keep archives of all the add-ons I use but these add-ons are quickly becoming out of date. The fact is that these add-ons are my first line of defense against browse based malware and privacy intrusion, not security updates for the browser and Operating System. Using them has worked for years and the only thing that most weakened my security is when Mozilla decides disable my add-ons when it ended "Lagacy" support. The net result is back comes the Pop-ups, ads, malware and extortion-ware trying to sneak in through the browser which my add-ons were blocking.

Anti-malware, anti-extortion-ware and anti-virus are, again in my opinion, reactive measures, not really effective proactive measures now matter how much they slow down a machine.

The ability to customize the browser's interface has been restricted so much with the deployment of WebExtensions that it affects unnecessarily productivity and, the loss Legacy add-on support is adversely affecting browser security rather than increasing it by eliminating important and useful defensive measures. It it possible to disable Legacy Support and WebExtensions, keep the functionality, and allow the user to choose?

Thanks for your consideration,

James Carey
MCSE, A+, Net+, Compaq and HP APS (Retired)

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by athenian200 » 2019-02-18, 18:13

I agree with this direction, there are plenty of Chrome/Firefox forks out there that support WebExtensions, but not very many that support XUL. I think focusing on that core functionality is very important, although I have sadly seen a lot of add-on authors act as if they're just going to abandon their projects once Thunderbird ESR drops support as if they're unaware of Pale Moon/Basilisk. I feel that having WebExtensions in Basilisk might have made some people unfamiliar with the project incorrectly think you were going to deprecate XUL extensions in the future at a slower pace than Mozilla, or saw WebExtensions as an inevitable/unavoidable direction. Dropping them to focus on XUL sends a very strong message about where your priorities lie.

With WebExtensions, there are fears that Google might even make it so that ad blockers don't work at all in Chrome (for "security reasons"), and then any other browsers that want to keep that functionality will have to use an incompatible version of them anyway. So we might still end up with Edge WebExtensions, Firefox WebExtensions, and Chrome WebExtensions all being incompatible with each other to varying degrees. I just don't see this API as any better or more future-proof than anything that came before it. At this point, I see sticking to an established, mature platform that not many others continue to support as the safer option.

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by Moonchild » 2019-02-18, 18:32

DeathNACan wrote: I understand your reasoning behind discontinuing WebExtension support and I wonder if you could put the option for the end user to turn it back on?
I'm sorry but this actually underlines more than anything that you in fact don't understand (or misunderstand) the reasoning behind discontinuing WebExtension support. This is not a user choice or user decision but a design decision to not try the impossible and instead support what technology is most in line with the platform; it is not "optional", it is not an arbitrary feature that can be switched on or off, but rather the problem with otherwise trying to support a quickly-diverting and substandard extension technology that we neither need nor can properly provide. Please re-read my opening post in this thread.
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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by ron_1 » 2019-02-18, 18:39

DeathNACan wrote:
Luckily, I keep archives of all the add-ons I use but these add-ons are quickly becoming out of date.
How so? Are any of your add-ons no longer working?

As far as uBo goes, as long as you keep the filters up to date, it'll keep working. In case you don't have it, the latest uBo for Pale Moon/Basilisk is 1.16.4.8, here.

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by Moonchild » 2019-02-18, 18:48

helloimustbegoing wrote:
DeathNACan wrote:
Luckily, I keep archives of all the add-ons I use but these add-ons are quickly becoming out of date.
How so? Are any of your add-ons no longer working?

As far as uBo goes, as long as you keep the filters up to date, it'll keep working. In case you don't have it, the latest uBo for Pale Moon/Basilisk is 1.16.4.8, here.
Indeed; simpler put: add-ons only need to be updated if:
  1. What they extend (the browser) changes in such a way that it's requiring an update for compatibility, OR
  2. The extension itself needs new/changed/additional functionality
Meaning that unlike the browser itself that needs to adapt to a constantly-changing web, extensions don't need to be updated nearly as often (or at all) and only depend on the structure of the browser or demands to the extension for needed change or "becoming out of date".
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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by Isengrim » 2019-02-18, 20:16

DeathNACan wrote:To make matters worse, Mozilla recently removed the entire archive of non-WebExtenstion add-ons from their site making finding them on the web at best very difficult and in most case impossible.
There are some archives of extensions available, as detailed in this post that may be of use to you as well.
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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2019-02-18, 20:22

@athenian200 FINALLY SOMEONE WHO GETS IT! Thank you very very much for your insightful look at the situation!

You have restored a chunk of my faith that humanity may not be totally lost.. This does so much for me personally! It is easy to rationalize and justify decisions to the people who you constantly interact with around these parts.. After all, a big part of that is why we are all here.. But to have someone such as your self reflect on it as you have done is worth more than you can know!

So again, thank you! :thumbup:
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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by gepus » 2019-02-19, 11:23

IMHO the right decision, even so I don't use Basilisk.
The reason for the decision was thoroughly explained by Tobin.
athenian 200 has also some valid arguments.
athenian200 wrote: With WebExtensions, there are fears that Google might even make it so that ad blockers don't work at all in Chrome (for "security reasons"), ...
Google won't dare to go so far, at least not for the time being. They are paddling now back with their Manifest 3 proposal.
You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time.

However Google managed already to limit drastically the user's control over the browser through webextensions and to impose them as quasi standard.

Actually you can only access directly (button) some internal prefs of Firefox only by using userChrome.js, something very few users are aware of.
It still works in Firefox 60.5esr but I'm pretty sure that this approach will be also killed at a future time.

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by Moonchild » 2019-02-19, 11:35

gepus wrote:Actually you can only access directly (button) some internal prefs of Firefox only by using userChrome.js, something very few users are aware of.
It still works in Firefox 60.5esr but I'm pretty sure that this approach will be also killed at a future time.
Mozilla never officially supported it so it will only work for as long as what it depends on still works/is present
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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by zapper » 2019-02-20, 06:25

Moonchild wrote:
New Tobin Paradigm wrote:What is being excluded?
I think he's talking about not providing product support for NoScript users.
Yeah, but its not really as much as an issue as I thought you guys not supporting it aka.

I wonder if its possible for forks to take that out of the blocklist though.
Last edited by zapper on 2019-02-20, 06:35, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by zapper » 2019-02-20, 06:32

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:NoScript is a special case, discussed at length.
Well, at least I finally agree with you guys on XUL being a good choice and Webextensions being terrible. Took me a while to get why you guys won't support webextensions, but some research showed me Moonchild and you were right about XUL being the way to go.

Plus, webextensions firefox dials back and forth a horrendous amount of time.

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by markz » 2019-03-17, 04:02

markz wrote:First of all, a heap of gratitude for the last browser available that runs several of my long time favorite Firefox extensions that no longer run in Firefox!!!!
These are Chickenfoot which I don't use much any more as I can do most things in TamperMonkey, http://up.csail.mit.edu/chickenfoot/
and DownThemAll! which I use every day. Is there a good password manager for Basilisk I can easily export my LassPass vault to?
That's the only one requiring WebExtension support that I miss. I can live with the built in password manager, but it will reduce the number of sites I visit with Basilisk.
The most recent LastPass add-on at: http://www.legacycollector.org/firefox- ... index.html
still works. Now I can happily stay current with new Basilisk releases. Thanks to all who posted links to legacycollector.org in other threads!

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Re: Basilisk's experimental WebExtension support will be dropped.

Unread post by Moonchild » 2019-03-17, 07:38

Locking this thread since it was just an announcement. Please take further discussion of and alternatives for extensions to the extensions board.
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