Default downloads location not being remembered

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Carebear
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Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Carebear » 2015-02-11, 16:10

I have PM set up in this way:

Always ask me where to save files is flagged.

All files downloaded to is therefor not flagged. However I did change the default location set there.

I would assume that everytime I download something an explorer window appears located at my default download folder which I can then change if I want to or just put the download there.

However, this seems to not be remembered in between sessions. PM remember my latest location during a session but after a restart the default folder that pops up in the explorer window is the path\pale moon\downloads\ folder.

Am I doing something wrong or is this supposed to happen?

I don't want to use path\pale moon\downloads\ which means that everytime I download something for the first time after a restart I have to browse to a different location. That's not fun.

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-02-11, 17:49

This is by design for the portable browser.
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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Carebear » 2015-02-12, 13:43

Is there a reason for that?

Also, does anyone know of an add-on that fixes this?

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2015-02-12, 14:49

It is BY DESIGN which means it is intended. This is overridden at a base level by the portable launcher. You cannot change it. If you want the experience of a fully installed web browser then you should USE a fully installed web browser
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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Carebear » 2015-02-12, 14:53

Matt A Tobin wrote:It is BY DESIGN which means it is intended. This is overridden at a base level by the portable launcher. You cannot change it. If you want the experience of a fully installed web browser then you should USE a fully installed web browser
That's why I asked:
Is there a reason for that?

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by SvenG » 2015-02-12, 15:11

Carebear wrote:That's why I asked:
Is there a reason for that?
The reason is that is is portable = not integrated into the system. So, that means that it will also not store any info related to the system it currently runs on because the next time it will run on another. That is imply the purpose of portable apps. If you don't want that, don't use a portable.

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Carebear » 2015-02-12, 15:15

SvenG wrote:
Carebear wrote:That's why I asked:
Is there a reason for that?
The reason is that is is portable = not integrated into the system. So, that means that it will also not store any info related to the system it currently runs on because the next time it will run on another. That is imply the purpose of portable apps. If you don't want that, don't use a portable.
Well it does store info about the default folder that came with it, which is just as much a part of the system as a different folder would be.

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2015-02-12, 15:19

By design.

RESOLVED INVALID
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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Carebear » 2015-02-12, 15:20

Anyway, looks like this can be fixed by removing this line:

Code: Select all

;(download directory)
browser.download.lastDir=$Download$|\\"
from the Palemoon-Portable.ini file.

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2015-02-12, 15:22

Don't expect support for unintended consequences of this action
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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-02-13, 00:54

Tobin, please try not to be too unfriendly to our users.

To answer the question "why" - I've already explained that in some other threads but I'll explain again:

The portable is designed to be self-contained and portable, to be put on removable media and taken from computer to computer.
Part of that design is that there should never be any assumption about the host PC and what folders exist or don't exist. It also means that it will attempt to not unintentionally end up leaving files or data on the host PC. As part of this design, therefore, the download folder is, intentionally, always reset to a folder that is inside the portable's own file structure upon launch. The portable design also incorporates a number of other settings that cause drawbacks for stationary use.

As Tobin already stated: if you want to use a system-installed, static version of Pale moon, then you need to use the installer version and not the portable.
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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Carebear » 2015-02-13, 12:12

Well, I very specifically do not want to use installer software.

If Pale Moon wasn't portable I would not have given it even one second of my time, regardless of how good it might be.

I have been trying to replace all of my used software with portable alternatives for years, even up to the point of thinapping stuff like Excel. So no, the installer is not an option.

My main reason for wanting to use portable software is because I detest the fact that installer software clutters up a system with all kinds of useless folders and files scattered around. It also makes it very annoying to do a full OS reinstall since it means you'll have to reinstall the software as well and also reset your custom settings.

I have been using Opera for about 10 years and in the last 5 years I used a portable version. I was very happy with it until the devs started screwing up the browser, making it bloatware and removing much needed customizability. I've resisted upgrading Opera for some time but now the older, no longer supported, versions have problems with the changing environment. New Opera is a no go and therefor I have been searching for an alternative. Tried a few, discarded them, then came to Pale Moon, and it's absolutely great. Better than all the other browsers I've ever tried. No joke. It is lighting fast and does almost everything I want from a browser. And it seems the FF add-ons have become at least as good as Opera's, which wasn't the case last decade. So it's highly likely that i'm sticking with it.

Now, I came to Pale Moon through a review on some site that turned up in a Google Search and just installed it and tried it, so I don't really know what your exact goals were with this software. I just used it in the same way I would use any other browser and the few problems I had I posted here, like this one. So when the response is "it's by design" I don't really know what to do with that.

You say
Part of that design is that there should never be any assumption about the host PC and what folders exist or don't exist. It also means that it will attempt to not unintentionally end up leaving files or data on the host PC.
Fine. That's your choice, of course and I'm sure it's consistent with your goals.

But why? Really!

Is it supposed to be like an incognito type of browser, like Tails, minus the Tor stuff? Or is there any other reason?

Because, you'll have to agree that from my perspective, it's annoying that I cannot have a custom default download folder in my set up, right?

From my point of view, and for what's it's worth, because I'm not the developer, just one user, so take it as you will, this:
Part of that design is that there should never be any assumption about the host PC and what folders exist or don't exist.


should be nuanced by adding "unless a user specifically enables the program to do so in certain instances".

To me that would make so much more sense.

Going back to the problem I have with installer software where it tends to create all kinds of unwanted folders, you know, the stuff in roaming/local/user/whatever. I hate that stuff, I'm very able to keep my own data system and it's much better and easier to navigate. Now instead of creating these folders like installer software does Pale Moon actually comes with it's own folder and forces me to use it. To me that's 99% the same thing. The program decides, not the user.

I have had my main download folder in a specific location for over a decade. Not only am I used to it being there, there are also other things that depend on it being there. My torrent client scans that folder for new .torrent files. A bunch of selfmade Autohotkey scripts work with that folder to collect data, clean it and do other stuff, and so on. Of course, I could change all those things to have them work with the ready made Pale Moon/Downloads folder, but why would I want to do that? I'm not interested in making all these changes just because some piece of software forces me to do so because that software is designed so "that there should never be any assumption about the host PC". I just don't see the argument in there.

Having said that, it's a minor thing, I could live with it, because Pale Moon's advantages outweigh this annoyance. I just wanted to illustrate for you how this is perceived on the user's end. Maybe that's something you will value and maybe not. Both is okay.

In fact, since I edited the config file, my problem melted away and I'm very happy now.

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-02-13, 12:29

Your intended use for the portable browser is clearly not the intended use as-designed by me ;)
That's fine though, and this is exactly why there is the flexibility of editing the .ini file to suit your needs instead of having an inflexible binary where you can't do this.

The funny thing is that you say you hate the very behavior I'm preventing here, the fact that "installer software tends to create all sorts of unwanted folders". If the download location isn't enforced in a portable, then the first thing the portable would do when plugged into a host system and started is create the download folder, wherever it was created for its last use. Depending on the host system, this may not even be possible, leaving the download location in an undetermined (and non-functional) state. Of course this is not a problem if you always use the portable on the same host system, but that is not what the portable has been designed for.
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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Carebear » 2015-02-13, 12:44

Moonchild wrote:Your intended use for the portable browser is clearly not the intended use as-designed by me ;)
That's fine though, and this is exactly why there is the flexibility of editing the .ini file to suit your needs instead of having an inflexible binary where you can't do this.

The funny thing is that you say you hate the very behavior I'm preventing here, the fact that "installer software tends to create all sorts of unwanted folders". If the download location isn't enforced in a portable, then the first thing the portable would do when plugged into a host system and started is create the download folder, wherever it was created for its last use. Depending on the host system, this may not even be possible, leaving the download location in an undetermined (and non-functional) state. Of course this is not a problem if you always use the portable on the same host system, but that is not what the portable has been designed for.
Don't get me wrong; I also do use my portable apps on other systems than my own main system from time to time and certainly my browser.
If the download location isn't enforced in a portable, then the first thing the portable would do when plugged into a host system and started is create the download folder, wherever it was created for its last use.
This doesn't have to be that way though. There is nothing problematic about a pop-up that says something like "default download folder cannot be find" with an explorer window to select a new location.

(In fact, it should be doable to make an add-on that can identify a specific system and give it a profile where you can set system-specific parameters like 'default download location'. Now that would be versatile to some. Although I don't personally need it.)

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by fusion01 » 2015-03-15, 14:51

Was this fix ever implemented? I also would like to define a specific download folder outside of the portable folder, but not want to have it then automatically create a new folder without asking me if I take the portable version and use another host computer.

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Re: Default downloads location not being remembered

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-03-15, 16:04

For the last time: this is BY DESIGN for the portable. Locking this thread because people obviously don't care to read what has been said multiple times.
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken, and use that is not intended for the portable will not be supported. It is designed to be portable, taken with you from system to system on removable media, and its operation and configuration reflect this.
Any other use is not accounted for and specific features needed for unintended use will not be implemented.
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