What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch dies?

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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Night Wing » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 14:51

danielson wrote:@Night Wing, don't like Maxthon either.
It's taking them forever to have extensions!
Don't like latest Opera either but at least they've got extensions!


When Opera removed the Bookmarks/Favorites toolbar, in my opinion and giving it a country flare, "That dog won't hunt". ;)

Looking back at my notes, when I tried Maxthon a long time ago (version 2.0), for some reason when I changed something in Maxthon, the change was also made in Internet Explorer. That was an automatic deal breaker for me.
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Night Wing » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 14:55

SaphirJD wrote:It is anyway ridiculous that an organization which clearly does not care at all for their product is still developing it.


I could be wrong on this, but I think Mozilla doesn't develope SeaMonkey anymore. It's developed and maintained by "volunteers" off the clock so to speak.
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby megaman » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 15:09

Maxthon didn't allow customizations. Sure it loads up fast even with tons of extensions, does fast rendering on things because of the WebKit core, and has a beautiful layout, but just didn't feel the same when I want things done differently. The ad blocker sucks on Maxthon, built-in and extensions, so that kicks Maxthon to the curb(Needs more developers).
Opera had better customizations than Maxthon, and still loads up fast, but it lacked customizations to some things that make it like Palemoon(At this point, I have no reason to say Firefox anyways).
Overall, customizations is what propels me to be okay with the browser, or I would have jumped ship when I was testing Chromium-based builds for a few months, back in 2011.
I make part of the short percentage that is not going to use Google for searching, for any reason, and I would have figured that everyone would have jumped on Chrome after its release, so I am surprised that people were still building for Firefox(Face it! They(Mozilla) are holding back on performance. We need someone that brings out the full-prowess of this browser).
Last edited by megaman on Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 15:11, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Sajadi » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 15:11

Night Wing wrote:
SaphirJD wrote:It is anyway ridiculous that an organization which clearly does not care at all for their product is still developing it.


I could be wrong on this, but I think Mozilla doesn't develope SeaMonkey anymore. It's developed and maintained by "volunteers" off the clock so to speak.


Was not meaning Seamonkey, i talked of Firefox of course ;)

megaman wrote:Maxthon didn't allow customizations.


Not entirely true, the version i use here for test reasons offers quite a nice set, sidebar, status bar, tabs at bottom, the search field when making a search on a website can be placed where one wants to have it. Works quite well as a secondary browser in my opinion. but depending on what will happening with Seamonkey when Australis hits, it would have the best chances to be my secondary browser in the future, if it can also avoid Australis.

But again, that has to be seen yet.

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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby danielson » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 18:52

HOLLY no more?
http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic ... &t=2809997

Pardon my ignorance but what does ESR stand for?
One fellow posted that Australis wouldn't be released until October.
I don't care about Australis so, that should be good news right?

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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Sajadi » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 19:02

ESR=Extended Service Release if i am not 100% wrong :D The perfect way for companies to have 1 year peace until Mozilla comes up with the next Chromification plans/plans to shrink Firefox market share

And yeah, Holly was killed, it was the last official Firefox version without Australis. All what is upcoming will feature this stupid Google styled crap.

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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Moonchild » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 19:03

Like I said, Holly has died. FF 29 (with Australis) has moved from alpha to beta channel, and updates on Holly have stopped because they don't want to carry an Australis-free browser through to the release channel.

The next ESR cycle will be based on FF 31, which will have Australis (unless Mozilla sees the error of their ways).
ESR stands for "Extended Support Release" which is a release version of Firefox that will receive back-ports by Mozilla of critical security fixes. It is intended for corporate users and organizations with centralized management where a 6-week feature churn is not acceptable and individual users who prefer not to follow the rapid release schedule.
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Night Wing » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 19:55

To paraphrase from Shakespeare's Hamlet.

"Alas poor Holly, I knew her well Horatio". ;)
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Moonchild » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 20:09

Will Pittenger wrote:
Moonchild wrote:ESR will be based on FF 31, which will have Australis (unless Mozilla sees the error of their ways).

Without Holly, the "unless Mozilla sees the error of their ways" part will be hard.

Not necessarily, because the majority of Australis has been implemented in FF29a2 already, and Holly is in a state where all of this has been backed out. If there's a change of heart, it will be possible to use some hg magic to apply most of the backouts in one go.
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby megaman » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 20:19

SaphirJD wrote:Not entirely true, the version i use here for test reasons offers quite a nice set, sidebar, status bar, tabs at bottom, the search field when making a search on a website can be placed where one wants to have it.

Maxthon:
Let's see...I can't middle-click to make a new tab when middle-clicking (Back, Forward, Reload, or Home Button) and option to be able to.
I can't middle click to open search in a new background tab, I have to choose an option that either opens in the active tab or open a new tab.
I can't move the buttons around.
Tabs at the top, while Windowed Mode? Nope.
Okay, maybe I was typing and asleep at the same time(Worked until 6 am and barely slept 4 hours, so I still was groggy), but only the Gecko builds can do the customizations that I deem worthy, we all have tastes. So, have at it. :)

I don't think writing to my Congress man will much, this time. He is already getting upset with my nagging("Not-worth-writing-to-your-Congress-man-type-of-letters"). I call for a Petition on Change.org, just like City of Heroes did. Protests, boycotting, or some other form of petition. (Okay, Megaman, needs to sleep. I can't believe that I am talking in Third Person)
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Evil Moo » Sun, 16 Mar 2014, 23:20

megaman wrote:...I can't middle-click to make a new tab when middle-clicking (Back, Forward, Reload, or Home Button)...


I wasn't aware this was a thing. Thanks for the information, I've occasionally been annoyed at not having a convenient new tab version of 'back', so this may well be quite useful. ^_^

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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Moonchild » Mon, 17 Mar 2014, 07:10

And if you're like me with way too long fingers for the average mouse so clicking the scroll-wheel is a PITA, you can Ctrl+Click to achieve the same ;)
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Daikun » Fri, 28 Mar 2014, 22:26

Moonchild wrote:As it is, it seems that the Holly branch, even though green in tinderbox, refuses to build on my dev machine.


Did you manage to find and fix the problem yet?

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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Moonchild » Sat, 29 Mar 2014, 08:36

Found, yes, fixed, no.
bug #939551 which impacts VS2012, VS2013.
It's not even confirmed as a bug by Mozilla (reported in November last year). I guess they "don't care that it doesn't build on what they don't use"?

Fixing it is not easy because of the totally backwards way this is done in the lib. Build a binary first and a separate tool, then extract essential information from that binary to use as source for compilation of something else... seriously?
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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Daikun » Fri, 25 Apr 2014, 10:58

PM 24.5 release notes:

Update branding: Remove nightly branding altogether - only have unofficial+official, and fix the broken About dialog branding.
Considering Pale Moon does not use Nightly, Aurora, or Beta channels, the branding as such has been removed. This leaves 2 types of branding:

Unofficial branding (the default if you build Pale Moon from source yourself) called "New Moon"
This unofficial branding does not have restrictions for distribution, and you are free to build and distribute your own binaries with this branding.
Official branding, "Pale Moon"
The official branding of Pale Moon, which you may only use for binaries you build from source to use yourself and not distribute without express permission, in accordance with the Pale Moon redistribution license.


So, is that it? We don't have to be concerned about what Mozilla does with Holly anymore?

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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby access2godzilla » Fri, 25 Apr 2014, 12:08

Daikun wrote:So, is that it? We don't have to be concerned about what Mozilla does with Holly anymore?

It's got nothing to do with the UI, only that this branding was removed, since we don't have nightlies.

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Re: What happens to Pale Moon when Firefox's Holly branch di

Unread postby Gary7 » Sat, 26 Apr 2014, 21:47

There is an extension out called "Classic Theme Restorer" that makes Firefox 29 with Australis look normal.


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