Windows 11 still sucks.

[UCyborg]

Anyone knows how compatible are new PCs with Win10? Is it getting left behind in favor of Win11 already?

[Moonchild]

As far as I know there is absolutely no issue with any hardware being supported by Windows 10.

[frostknight]

As far as I know there is absolutely no issue with any hardware being supported by Windows 10.

I hear there is a LTSC version of windows 11 as well. Funny thing, copilot isn't enabled on it.

I wonder why....



Not really, enterprise software can't be that buggy. lol

According to sources I found online.

Youtuber is one example.

Also this:

https://www.windowslatest.com/2026/03/0 ... her-bloat/

[Mæstro]

This does far more to improve Windows 11 than anything else yet brought up in this thread. It helps to recall that ‘internet of things’ is just a new name for embedded software. The embedded versions of an OS always last the longest, as we have seen since XP. LTSC is also always superior to the domestic edition; we could already see this in the Windows 10 days, and much of the work towards mitigating Windows 10 has just involved restoring LTSC features slsewhere. Rehabilitative work is ongoing, even if it sometimes takes a few years. I am reminded of DRM cracking. The general lesson here is to avoid living on the bleeding edge.

[Moonchild]

And if you really need something more "out of the box" you could even consider using a Server edition of Windows, e.g. Windows Server 2022.
In my migration efforts I made the mistake to initially use Server 2025 on the one Windows-based server I maintain. It was a disaster (slow as molasses, constantly pushing for cloud shit, etc.); after just a day I wiped it, tossing away my time thus far spent setting it up, and installed Server 2022, which is basically Windows 10 21H2 LTSC but then building on the "Iron" kernel (as opposed to "Vibranium" used for desktop SKUs) basically Win 10 with a bunch of under the hood improvements but without the front-end overhaul disaster and marketing bs of Win 11.

[Gemmaugr]

It helps to recall that ‘internet of things’ is just a new name for embedded software.

Just a slight correction here, it would be embedded software that's Online. It changes things. Literally and figuratively. Updates (for better or worse), subscription models, changing protocols, privacy, etc.

[Night Wing]

I was on YouTube earlier this morning and ran across this video from a former Microsoft employee. The video has been out for around 5 days now at the time of this post.

The video below is basically what direction Microsoft is taking with the present (Retail) version of Windows 11 and future versions of it's operating system (if there are future versions).

It is a long 21 minute video so be aware of this. But there is a lot of good information in it. Also, the comments below the video are an interesting read and there are a LOT of comments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7a89ZYcTo8

[UCyborg]

^Windows has indeed turned into something else.

Off-topic:
Once in a blue moon I look at new computers. But then I think, I don't even do anything interesting on the old one, which still serves me well. Although there is a suspicion +5V SB (stand-by) rail has weakened / destabilized over time, considering the recent more frequent occurrences of failing to resume from sleep, where not all fans start back up and machine appears frozen and unresponsive to reset button, though it can be powered off by holding power button for 5 seconds, then it can be turned back on and it will restore the session from disk.

It seems having the smartphone (or phone + external USB disk) plugged in at the time of resume considerably increases probability of failure. These are two devices I may have plugged in besides all the usual things plugged in all the time. And since about 2 years ago, compared to most if this computer's lifetime (it will be 17 in April), there are 3 RAM sticks to power rather than 2.

So the options I seem to have:

1. Do nothing.
2. Consider power supply replacement.
3. Poke inside the old one, these things supposedly have specific capacitor dealing with +5V SB rail...me and electronics though...
4. Fast-forward to 2020s and buy a brand new PC.

[Night Wing]

Off-topic:
So the options I seem to have:

1. Do nothing.
2. Consider power supply replacement.
3. Poke inside the old one, these things supposedly have specific capacitor dealing with +5V SB rail...me and electronics though...
4. Fast-forward to 2020s and buy a brand new PC.

Off-topic:
There is a 5th option.

Build a computer from scratch. This is what I did when I bought a new Montech mid tower gaming tower computer. And I do "not" play games on it. I got it because of it's increased size over a mid tower business computer. It is easy to work with on the inside of it.

Then I put my a more beefy motherboard in it which can access up to 128 GB of memory if I want, a 12 generation Intel i7 processor with 3.60 processor speed, new heat sink with fan, four 140 mm cooling fans, newer AMD graphics card, 64 GB's of memory and my old "quiet" power supply.

Just something for you to think about.

[frostknight]

Then I put my a more beefy motherboard in it which can access up to 128 GB of memory if I want, a 12 generation Intel i7 processor with 3.60 processor speed, new heat sink with fan, four 140 mm cooling fans, newer AMD graphics card, 64 GB's of memory and my old "quiet" power supply.

Just something for you to think about.

Off-topic:
With all due respect, who even needs 32GB of ram let alone more?

I have 32GB on my current laptop, but I don't usually even break 16GB even when playing SC2 via wine on my Devuan laptop.

I doubt windows users even break 32GB unless they are compiling something huge.

If I am wrong, give me other examples, because I have never heard of any.

Feel free to seriously.

[Moonchild]

Off-topic:

who even needs 32GB of ram let alone more?

I do. I'm not doing anything special or intensive right now and I'm using:

Image1.jpg

I just tend to multitask intensively as a baseline (my task bar is often quite filled).

I wish I had bought another 32 GB kit when prices were still normal because I have run into the 32 GB memory limit with some video creation recently. But that's off the table now and I pray my RAM won't develop any problems or I'm up a creek without a paddle.

[UCyborg]

Off-topic:
There is a 5th option.

Build a computer from scratch. This is what I did when I bought a new Montech mid tower gaming tower computer. And I do "not" play games on it. I got it because of it's increased size over a mid tower business computer. It is easy to work with on the inside of it.

Then I put my a more beefy motherboard in it which can access up to 128 GB of memory if I want, a 12 generation Intel i7 processor with 3.60 processor speed, new heat sink with fan, four 140 mm cooling fans, newer AMD graphics card, 64 GB's of memory and my old "quiet" power supply.

Just something for you to think about.

Off-topic:
I got this one by selecting specific components, then it was assembled at the place I bought it, though it didn't quite turn out as planned as that shop ran out of that specific motherboard model, so instead of ending up with what was known as AMD Dragon, I ended up with something hybrid using NVIDIA chipset. Though I probably wouldn't go this route this time, not sure I'd do much better than some decent pre-built options.

It was suggested to look at the motherboard manual to check if I have some not necessary USB peripheral plugged to a port that stays powered all the time, to move it somewhere else if not needed to be powered during sleep. And that I could try measuring +5V SB rail with the multimeter when it resumes.

It just happened again, this time, without phone or disk plugged in. :/

[Night Wing]

Off-topic:
With all due respect, who even needs 32GB of ram let alone more?

I have 32GB on my current laptop, but I don't usually even break 16GB even when playing SC2 via wine on my Devuan laptop.

I doubt windows users even break 32GB unless they are compiling something huge.

If I am wrong, give me other examples, because I have never heard of any.

Feel free to seriously.

Off-topic:
There is an old adage and it goes like this:

"Better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it."

When I decided to build my own tower computer, I did so for a few reasons. I wanted a "quiet" computer sound wise. I chose a mid size gaming tower because I got tired of working on business style mid sized towers due to the cramped space inside of the case where a mid tower gaming computer case is a lot "bigger" so it is easier to work on.

And back then prices for computer tower cases were inexpensive, memory was inexpensive, motherboards were inexpensive, processors were inexpensive, etc. At today's prices, everything is much more expensive. Memory is double in price now.

I chose a Montech Air 930 Max gaming mid tower because of the space it came and the case came with four, 140 mm fans to push a lot of air to keep things cool since they are adjustable for speed (PWM's). I do not have to worry about heating problems or sound problems. So I balanced high cooling with quiet sound.

Also it can handle any size of motherboard from the smallest to the largest size since the holes in this Montech case are already pre-drilled for any size motherboard.

And right now my cpu temperature as I type this post is 27.8 C and my amdgpu graphics card is (39.0 C). And my amdgpu fan speed is 792 rpm's. I have a very quiet and cool temperature wise tower computer.

I hope these examples are good enough for you. But if they are not, post your own laptop's specs and lets compare mine against your's.

[Night Wing]

Off-topic:
I got this one by selecting specific components, then it was assembled at the place I bought it, though it didn't quite turn out as planned as that shop ran out of that specific motherboard model, so instead of ending up with what was known as AMD Dragon, I ended up with something hybrid using NVIDIA chipset. Though I probably wouldn't go this route this time, not sure I'd do much better than some decent pre-built options.

It was suggested to look at the motherboard manual to check if I have some not necessary USB peripheral plugged to a port that stays powered all the time, to move it somewhere else if not needed to be powered during sleep. And that I could try measuring +5V SB rail with the multimeter when it resumes.

It just happened again, this time, without phone or disk plugged in. :/

Off-topic:
I am lucky that I volunteer at a computer repair shop. Many times old customers and also new customers will bring their tower computers and just take out their old hard drives and leave the rest of the component parts (processors, cooling fans, graphics cards, heat sinks, etc; still in their tower cases.

Two weeks ago, a customer came in and dropped off their old tower computer to be "recylcled". But for me a recycled tower computer is a tower for me to be "scavenged" to see if I can use any component parts for myself. I prefer AMD graphics cards over Nvidia graphics when it comes to linux distros. I won't go into the reasons why, but it has something to do with the drivers Nvidia offers in Linux.

This tower had an older AMD graphics card that I knew was better than my newer AMD graphics card I was already using. I asked the shop owner, who is my next door neighbor, "How much for me to buy it". He told me I was like a "pack rat" and just "take it", no cost to me if I could use it. You can see it in the graphics heading in my specifications below.

One quirk though. The systems fans in my tower computer are never mentioned in my system's specifications. To see them, I have to go into the BIOS on my motherboard to find out what they are spinning at in rpm's. The four PWM 140 mm fans are around 685-726 rpm's depending on what I am doing on this tower computer.

BTW, Amazon is a great place to pick up good component parts if you are interested in building a tower computer. But most people like laptops for their portability. And that is a trade off.

Code: Select all

System:
  Kernel: 6.12.74+deb13+1-amd64 arch: x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc v: 14.2.0 clocksource: tsc
    avail: hpet,acpi_pm parameters: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-6.12.74+deb13+1-amd64
    root=UUID=<filter> ro quiet splash
  Desktop: Xfce v: 4.20.1 tk: Gtk v: 3.24.48 wm: xfwm4 v: 4.20.0 with: xfce4-panel tools:
    avail: xfce4-screensaver vt: 7 dm: LightDM v: 1.32.0 Distro: MX-25.1_x64 Infinity Nov 9 2025
    base: Debian GNU/Linux 13 (trixie)
Machine:
  Type: Desktop Mobo: Micro-Star model: MAG B660M MORTAR WIFI DDR4 (MS-7D42) v: 1.0
    serial: <superuser required> uuid: <superuser required> UEFI: American Megatrends LLC. v: 1.M0
    date: 04/17/2025
CPU:
  Info: model: 12th Gen Intel Core i7-12700K bits: 64 type: MST AMCP arch: Alder Lake gen: core 12
    level: v3 note: check built: 2021+ process: Intel 7 (10nm ESF) family: 6 model-id: 0x97 (151)
    stepping: 2 microcode: 0x3D
  Topology: cpus: 1x dies: 1 clusters: 9 cores: 12 threads: 20 mt: 8 tpc: 2 st: 4 smt: enabled
    cache: L1: 1024 KiB desc: d-4x32 KiB, 8x48 KiB; i-8x32 KiB, 4x64 KiB L2: 12 MiB
    desc: 8x1.2 MiB, 1x2 MiB L3: 25 MiB desc: 1x25 MiB
  Speed (MHz): avg: 800 min/max: 800/4900:5000:3800 scaling: driver: intel_pstate
    governor: powersave cores: 1: 800 2: 800 3: 800 4: 800 5: 800 6: 800 7: 800 8: 800 9: 800 10: 800
    11: 800 12: 800 13: 800 14: 800 15: 800 16: 800 17: 800 18: 800 19: 800 20: 800
    bogomips: 144383
  Flags: avx avx2 ht lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx
  Vulnerabilities:
  Type: gather_data_sampling status: Not affected
  Type: indirect_target_selection status: Not affected
  Type: itlb_multihit status: Not affected
  Type: l1tf status: Not affected
  Type: mds status: Not affected
  Type: meltdown status: Not affected
  Type: mmio_stale_data status: Not affected
  Type: reg_file_data_sampling mitigation: Clear Register File
  Type: retbleed status: Not affected
  Type: spec_rstack_overflow status: Not affected
  Type: spec_store_bypass mitigation: Speculative Store Bypass disabled via prctl
  Type: spectre_v1 mitigation: usercopy/swapgs barriers and __user pointer sanitization
  Type: spectre_v2 mitigation: Enhanced / Automatic IBRS; IBPB: conditional; PBRSB-eIBRS: SW
    sequence; BHI: BHI_DIS_S
  Type: srbds status: Not affected
  Type: tsa status: Not affected
  Type: tsx_async_abort status: Not affected
  Type: vmscape mitigation: IBPB before exit to userspace
Graphics:
  Device-1: Intel AlderLake-S GT1 vendor: Micro-Star MSI driver: i915 v: kernel alternate: xe
    arch: Xe process: Intel 10nm built: 2020-21 ports: active: none empty: DP-1, DP-2, HDMI-A-1,
    HDMI-A-2, HDMI-A-3, HDMI-A-4 bus-ID: 00:02.0 chip-ID: 8086:4680 class-ID: 0380
  Device-2: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD/ATI] Ellesmere [Radeon RX 470/480/570/570X/580/580X/590]
    vendor: XFX Pine driver: amdgpu v: kernel arch: GCN-4 code: Arctic Islands process: GF 14nm
    built: 2016-20 pcie: gen: 3 speed: 8 GT/s lanes: 16 ports: active: HDMI-A-5 empty: DP-3, DP-4,
    DP-5, DVI-D-1 bus-ID: 01:00.0 chip-ID: 1002:67df class-ID: 0300 temp: 38.0 C
  Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 21.1.16 compositor: xfwm4 v: 4.20.0 driver: X:
    loaded: amdgpu,modesetting unloaded: fbdev,vesa dri: radeonsi gpu: amdgpu display-ID: :0.0
    screens: 1
  Screen-1: 0 s-res: 1920x1080 s-dpi: 96 s-size: 509x286mm (20.04x11.26") s-diag: 584mm (22.99")
  Monitor-1: HDMI-A-5 mapped: HDMI-A-4 model: ViewSonic VX3276-FHD serial: <filter> built: 2022
    res: mode: 1920x1080 hz: 60 scale: 100% (1) dpi: 70 gamma: 1.2 size: 698x393mm (27.48x15.47")
    diag: 801mm (31.5") ratio: 16:9 modes: max: 1920x1080 min: 720x400
  API: EGL v: 1.5 hw: drv: intel iris drv: amd radeonsi platforms: device: 0 drv: radeonsi
    device: 1 drv: iris device: 2 drv: swrast gbm: drv: kms_swrast surfaceless: drv: radeonsi x11:
    drv: radeonsi inactive: wayland
  API: OpenGL v: 4.6 compat-v: 4.5 vendor: amd mesa v: 25.0.7-2 glx-v: 1.4 direct-render: yes
    renderer: AMD Radeon RX 580 Series (radeonsi polaris10 ACO DRM 3.61 6.12.74+deb13+1-amd64)
    device-ID: 1002:67df memory: 7.81 GiB unified: no
  API: Vulkan v: 1.4.309 layers: 3 device: 0 type: discrete-gpu name: AMD Radeon RX 580 Series
    (RADV POLARIS10) driver: mesa radv v: 25.0.7-2 device-ID: 1002:67df surfaces: xcb,xlib
    device: 1 type: integrated-gpu name: Intel UHD Graphics 770 (ADL-S GT1) driver: mesa intel
    v: 25.0.7-2 device-ID: 8086:4680 surfaces: xcb,xlib device: 2 type: cpu name: llvmpipe (LLVM
    19.1.7 256 bits) driver: mesa llvmpipe v: 25.0.7-2 (LLVM 19.1.7) device-ID: 10005:0000
    surfaces: xcb,xlib
  Info: Tools: api: eglinfo, glxinfo, vulkaninfo de: xfce4-display-settings x11: xdriinfo,
    xdpyinfo, xprop, xrandr
Audio:
  Device-1: Intel Alder Lake-S HD Audio vendor: Micro-Star MSI driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel
    alternate: snd_soc_avs,snd_sof_pci_intel_tgl bus-ID: 00:1f.3 chip-ID: 8086:7ad0 class-ID: 0403
  Device-2: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD/ATI] Ellesmere HDMI Audio [Radeon RX 470/480 /
    570/580/590] vendor: XFX Pine driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel pcie: gen: 3 speed: 8 GT/s
    lanes: 16 bus-ID: 01:00.1 chip-ID: 1002:aaf0 class-ID: 0403
  API: ALSA v: k6.12.74+deb13+1-amd64 status: kernel-api tools: alsactl,alsamixer,amixer
  Server-1: PipeWire v: 1.4.5 status: active with: 1: pipewire-pulse status: active
    2: wireplumber status: active 3: pipewire-alsa type: plugin 4: pw-jack type: plugin
    tools: pactl,pw-cat,pw-cli,wpctl
Network:
  Device-1: Intel Alder Lake-S PCH CNVi WiFi driver: iwlwifi v: kernel modules: wl bus-ID: 00:14.3
    chip-ID: 8086:7af0 class-ID: 0280
  IF: wlan0 state: down mac: <filter>
  Device-2: Realtek RTL8125 2.5GbE vendor: Micro-Star MSI driver: r8169 v: kernel pcie: gen: 2
    speed: 5 GT/s lanes: 1 port: 4000 bus-ID: 03:00.0 chip-ID: 10ec:8125 class-ID: 0200
  IF: eth0 state: up speed: 1000 Mbps duplex: full mac: <filter>
  Info: services: NetworkManager, nfsd, systemd-networkd, wpa_supplicant
Bluetooth:
  Device-1: Intel AX201 Bluetooth driver: btusb v: 0.8 type: USB rev: 2.0 speed: 12 Mb/s lanes: 1
    mode: 1.1 bus-ID: 1-14:7 chip-ID: 8087:0026 class-ID: e001
  Report: hciconfig ID: hci0 rfk-id: 1 state: up address: <filter> bt-v: 5.2 lmp-v: 11
    sub-v: 37c8 hci-v: 11 rev: 37c8 class-ID: 6c0104
  Info: acl-mtu: 1021:4 sco-mtu: 96:6 link-policy: rswitch sniff link-mode: peripheral accept
    service-classes: rendering, capturing, audio, telephony
Drives:
  Local Storage: total: 912.89 GiB used: 21.39 GiB (2.3%)
  SMART Message: Unable to run smartctl. Root privileges required.
  ID-1: /dev/sda maj-min: 8:0 vendor: Samsung model: SSD 870 EVO 500GB size: 465.76 GiB
    block-size: physical: 512 B logical: 512 B speed: 6.0 Gb/s tech: SSD serial: <filter>
    fw-rev: 2B6Q scheme: GPT
  ID-2: /dev/sdb maj-min: 8:16 vendor: SanDisk model: SSD PLUS 480GB size: 447.13 GiB block-size:
    physical: 512 B logical: 512 B speed: 6.0 Gb/s tech: SSD serial: <filter> fw-rev: 04RL
    scheme: GPT
Partition:
  ID-1: / raw-size: 446.88 GiB size: 438.79 GiB (98.19%) used: 21.38 GiB (4.9%) fs: ext4
    dev: /dev/sdb2 maj-min: 8:18
  ID-2: /boot/efi raw-size: 256 MiB size: 252 MiB (98.46%) used: 8.7 MiB (3.5%) fs: vfat
    dev: /dev/sdb1 maj-min: 8:17
Swap:
  Kernel: swappiness: 15 (default 60) cache-pressure: 100 (default) zswap: no
  ID-1: swap-1 type: file size: 8 GiB used: 0 KiB (0.0%) priority: -2 file: /swap/swap
Sensors:
  System Temperatures: cpu: 29.2 C mobo: N/A gpu: amdgpu temp: 38.0 C
  Fan Speeds (rpm): N/A gpu: amdgpu fan: 796
Repos:
  Packages: pm: dpkg pkgs: 2463 libs: 1310 tools: apt, apt-get, aptitude, nala, synaptic pm: rpm
    pkgs: 0 pm: flatpak pkgs: 0
  No active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/debian.sources
    1: deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ trixie main  contrib non-free non-free-firmware
    2: deb http://security.debian.org/debian-security/ trixie-security main  contrib non-free non-free-firmware
    3: deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ trixie-updates  main contrib non-free non-free-firmware
  Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/mx.sources
    1: deb https://mxrepo.com/mx/repo/ trixie main non-free
Info:
  Memory: total: 64 GiB available: 62.53 GiB used: 2.08 GiB (3.3%)
  Processes: 416 Power: uptime: 4h 5m states: freeze,mem,disk suspend: deep avail: s2idle
    wakeups: 1 hibernate: platform avail: shutdown, reboot, suspend, test_resume image: 24.96 GiB
    services: upowerd,xfce4-power-manager Init: systemd v: 257 default: graphical tool: systemctl
  Compilers: gcc: 14.2.0 Client: shell wrapper v: 5.2.37-release inxi: 3.3.38
Boot Mode: UEFI

[frostknight]

I do. I'm not doing anything special or intensive right now and I'm using:

Image1.jpg
Image1.jpg (16.28 KiB) Viewed 42 times

Seems your using 20GB of ram. Interesting... I wonder how many applications and what applications are open on your computer.

But as nightwing said

There is an old adage and it goes like this:

"Better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it."

Agree.

I barely use half, but I got 32GB of ram out of caution (even on my gaming linux laptop)

[Mæstro]

Windows 11’s egregious deeds are again the subject of a HowToGeek article. Laymen can be considered sufficiently informed of the problems. I wonder what share of Windows users attempts to use any of the available purging tools, or bothers to check the privacy settings.

[UCyborg]

Something I noticed trialing Win11 23H2, suspending any graphical program's process, its window would not be replaced by a ghost window that can be moved around or minimised. Reminds of dark ages of Windows XP.

Off-topic:
I noticed my resume from sleep problem is cured by removing 3rd stick of RAM. Great, there goes the RAM upgrade. Where on Earth would I find another DDR2 stick in 2026...at least DDR3 is still easily obtainable.

[ownedbywuigi]

Anyone knows how compatible are new PCs with Win10? Is it getting left behind in favor of Win11 already?

Only like 2 laptops I have ever seen needed to run 11 21H2 at the very least (I haven't tried Server 2022 on them, which is just 11 with a 10 UI)

But for the most part, 99% of computers new still support 10 until I'm guessing 2028.

[ownedbywuigi]

But for the most part, 99% of computers new still support 10 until I'm guessing 2028.

I'm pretty sure 10 will never stop getting driver support from some OEMs just because they fall under NT 10, like for example NVidia and AMD still support 10 RTM (from 11 years ago soon!) just because they fall under NT 10, just like the latest 11 Canary.

Same for applications, Firefox, Chromium, etc, will probably continue to support 10 (ALL VERSIONS, or at the very least, discriminate 10 versions by build number) until MS makes a new NT version (they won't, they legitimately haven't had a human work on Windows unless it was urgent since Germanium WaaS)

[UCyborg]

Are you sure the very first Win10 still works with latest NVIDIA drivers? I read on another forum they don't, at least out-of-box. Those first Win10 releases are different from newer ones.

Edit:

Off-topic:
I noticed my resume from sleep problem is cured by removing 3rd stick of RAM. Great, there goes the RAM upgrade. Where on Earth would I find another DDR2 stick in 2026...at least DDR3 is still easily obtainable.

Off-topic:
Third stick by itself in its usual third slot is fine. I'll see what the new PSU does . If no change, I'll avoid using sleep for now.