beta 2 hangs

[Pallid Planetoid]

I've been having issues with Pale Moon 28.0.0b2 getting laggy after extended use resulting with intermittent browser "not responding" messages sometimes sporadicaly occurring sequentially which leads me to eventually close the browser since it becomes increasingly difficult to use the browser at this point.

Now tonight Pale Moon ended up completely hung (not responding at all) so had no other choice than to stop the process.

Windows Event Viewer describes issue as "Event Name: AppHangB1" (FWIW).

WhatIsHang states the following for Remarks: * The program probably hangs because there is an infinite loop, very long loop, or recursive calls.

I have Windows Event Viewer data part of which is here:

The program palemoon.exe version 4.1.3.6752 stopped interacting with Windows and was closed. To see if more information about the problem is available, check the problem history in the Action Center control panel.
Process ID: 1250
Start Time: 01d4135b0d42880d
Termination Time: 364
Application Path: C:\Program Files (x86)\Pale Moon\palemoon.exe
Report Id:


Fault bucket 50, type 5
Event Name: AppHangB1
Response: Not available
Cab Id: 0

Problem signature:
P1: palemoon.exe
P2: 4.1.3.6752
P3: 5b386c0d
P4: bb10
P5: 6144
P6:
P7:
P8:
P9:
P10:

and I also have WhatIsHang data part of which is here:

Hang report for C:\Program Files (x86)\Pale Moon\palemoon.exe
Generated by using WhatIsHang on 7/4/2018 12:12:47 AM
Web site: http://www.nirsoft.net


Remarks:
* The program probably hangs because there is an infinite loop, very long loop, or recursive calls.


Strings found in the stack:
_lastHit
ZYPSQRÿuØÿuÔÿu ÿuº
filters
pXYZRQPƒìpt$`l$Pd$@\$0T$ L$$‹ÌƒäüQ¹


Modules found in the stack:
C:\Program Files (x86)\Pale Moon\xul.dll , Mozilla Foundation , Palemoon,
C:\Program Files (x86)\Pale Moon\mozglue.dll , Mozilla Foundation , Palemoon,



Attached files:
C:\Users\user\AppData\Local\Temp\WER98CF.tmp.appcompat.txt
C:\Users\user\AppData\Local\Temp\WERB391.tmp.WERInternalMetadata.xml

There is more data available (especially from WhatIsHang) if it would be of any additional help (which I can post in that case).

I have no idea when this might occur and since it could be days or even weeks before the same problem might present itself I am unable to test in Save Mode.

I would add that it is of course impossibly to rule out the possibility that the issue is a unique problem on my end and therefore may not involve Pale Moon directly --- so with that in mind this as an FYI ONLY FWIW (not knowing if this info is of any help perhaps extensive stress-testing the beta release may provide clues which occurs to me as I write this is presumably done anyway ).

[therube]

How much RAM, CPU are in use at time of hang?

[Pallid Planetoid]

How much RAM, CPU are in use at time of hang?

This is all the information I captured at the time of the hang regarding Pale Moon and overall computer usage (which doesn't seem that bad at the time):

at time of hang.png

Entire CPU usage is only 26% of which Pale Moon is taking up 25% so the overall computer isn't overloaded.

[therube]

When I saw:

Code: Select all

Application Path: C:\Program Files (x86)\Pale Moon\palemoon.exe

I was going to question that, but then I was like, eh, where it's installed is really no big deal.

But now you're throwing *32 into the mix!

What's up with that?

And that 25%, is that of 4-core CPU?
(Or is it 2-core, 4-threads on your end. If so, not quite sure how that relates [to what I'm used to, 4-core, 4-threads]?)
If so, that is 100% of 1 core.
In any case, at 25%, while there may not necessarily be an apparent impact on usage, something is going on, something is eating CPU, more so then what one might think to be a more "normal", "idle" impact of oh, a few percent, perhaps 5%.

[Pallid Planetoid]

I'm using Pale Moon (32-bit) -- and have dual-core on my i3 processor.

As far as the 25% -- this is always the case when I'm on my start.me start-page tab -- if I go to say the PM forum tab (where I am now) the usage goes to virtually 0.

So going back and forth between my start-page it changes from 25% to 0% and back again between the two tabs -- and that has always basically been the case.

So yes, the start.me start-page does eat CPU and is not anything new as it's always been this way and I've never experienced a Pale Moon hang like this for years -- not until I've been on the beta release anyway.

My start-page has about 9-10 News Feed modules with around 25 individual News Feeds per module not to mention other widgets like the weather for example -- so I guess the 25% usage is to be expected perhaps. This is not that particularly extensive -- I used to have twice that size for my start-page but trimmed it down by half to help with page-load time. Start.me did an upgrade back in January of this year that didn't work out to well in my opinion which caused overlay issues until I went with the unstable 28 Pale Moon that thankfully resolved the specific overlay problems. Also Start.me is supposed to release a new build on the 18th of this month to deal with issues they created with the "2018 upgrade" in January one of which is to improve on page-load issues they've had ever since the upgrade. Hopefully they will also address CPU usage if at all possible at that time as well.

[therube]

(Oh, it kind of slipped my mind that they are also building 32-bit...)

Anyhow, what OS?
Why not 64-bit browser?

The most a 32-bit process can use is ~2GB RAM, & your numbers show you are mighty close to that, so at that point it would be expected for the browser to become squirrely, to crash, to hang.

When you are close to maximums, & you are, that is one of the times that 64-bit is of benefit, & should give you a bit more leeway.


> As far as the 25% -- this is always the case when I'm on my start.me start-page tab

Yes, that is expected.

[Pallid Planetoid]

I suspect to change from 32-bit to 64-bit would require a fresh (new) install of Pale Moon (which involves a bit of work to keep things the way I like it with all my add-ons and profile "as is" presumably)... ugh!

[SpockFan02]

I suspect to change from 32-bit to 64-bit would require a fresh (new) install of Pale Moon (which involves a bit of work to keep things the way I like it with all my add-ons and profile "as is" presumably)... ugh!

Unless your add-ons use binary XPCOM components (I think 'XPCOM components' is redundant but whatever), I don't think it should matter... Unless your profile is in different directories on Windows depending on 32-bit or 64-bit. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edit: It seems like maybe it is, sorry for being an idiot... But you could probably just copy your profile over to keep your add-ons and customizations and history and bookmarks and whatnot.

[therube]

An install may default to some particular location, but that is really immaterial.
A Profile may default to some particular location, but that too is really immaterial.

Backup first.

Install x64 & go.

No need to change Profiles, install locations, or anything else particularly.
If it doesn't work out, restore from your backup.

profiles.ini is not in your install directory, nor in your Profile directory, & it can't hurt to back that up too .

[Pallid Planetoid]

^ You're saying simply install 64bit on-top of 32bit (over the current PM) -- no uninstall of the current Pale Moon 32bit should or needs to be done?

[EbonJaeger]

^ You're saying simply install 64bit on-top of 32bit (over the current PM) -- no uninstall of the current Pale Moon 32bit should or needs to be done?

Pretty much. By default, PM installs to the Program Files folder. Profiles reside generally in your user folder, and you can see exactly where by clicking Help > Troubleshooting Information. To be safe, go there, and copy your profile folder to another location and bam, you have a backup.

[roytam1]

I think it is hitting "memory roof" when it is full-loading 1 of cores.
you may check "about:memory" to see if heap-unclassified has large amount or not.

[Pallid Planetoid]

I think it is hitting "memory roof" when it is full-loading 1 of cores.
you may check "about:memory" to see if heap-unclassified has large amount or not.

My result: "101.39 MB (19.42%) ── heap-unclassified" --- how does that look?

.... hmm or does this need to be checked at the time of the hang? (if so it may be a while as this was the first time I've had this situation occur).

[roytam1]

I think it is hitting "memory roof" when it is full-loading 1 of cores.
you may check "about:memory" to see if heap-unclassified has large amount or not.

My result: "101.39 MB (19.42%) ── heap-unclassified" --- how does that look?

.... hmm or does this need to be checked at the time of the hang? (if so it may be a while as this was the first time I've had this situation occur).

~100MB of heap-unclassified isn't that much by the way.

[therube]

Backup first.

You can always uninstall 32-bit if you want.
You can always reinstall it if you need to.
Might be a little cleaner if you did uninstall.

Generally 32/64-bit should be a non-issue with extensions.

Plugins could be a different matter, where you would need bit-compatible versions of a Plugin for a particular bitness of a browser. So 32-bit browser needs 32-bit Java. 64-bit browser needs 64-bit Java. (And then there could be instances where a particular Plugin is only available, says as 32-bit, which would relegate you to a 32-bit browser.) (But then actual Plugin usage is essentially dead these days, with about the only thing remaining is Flash & even that is fairly rare at this point.)

[Moonchild]

The most a 32-bit process can use is ~2GB RAM

I'm afraid you're wrong here.
32-bit processes on a 64-bit OS can allocate up to 4GB of RAM (usually a little less because address space tends to get exhausted sooner, but still around 3.7/3.8 GB). at close to 2GB in use, that's not close to the limit at all.

Running Pale Moon 32-bit on a 64-bit Windows OS is very viable and normal -- especially if you don't have a system with a dedicated GPU, since 64-bit drivers for embedded/integrated graphics tend to lack stability. Additionally, dedicated plugins (e.g. for corporate use or authentication) are often not available in 64-bit versions and cannot be used in a 64-bit browser.

[therube]

Well assuming a program is compiled with /LARGEADDRESSAWARE, which I figure PM must include?

In FF 38, examining firefox.exe, I see, "App can handle >2GB addresses".
(Don't have 32-bit PM on hand to check.)
OK, in PM too.