One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Discussions about the development and maturation of the Unified XUL Platform (UXP).
Warning: may contain highly-technical topics.

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gracious1
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One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby gracious1 » Mon, 04 Dec 2017, 07:13

One extension developer who is supporting Pale Moon expressed a desire to be able to release a one-size-fits-all version that works in all current XUL browsers. Right now, he has to make one for (pre-Quantum) Fx/Waterfox/Basilisk and one for Pale Moon.

My understanding is that the perfection of UXP would make this possible?
Image“We look forward to the time when the Power of Love will replace the Love of Power. Then will our world know the blessings of peace.” ― Wm. Ewart Gladstone ◊ Int'l Day of Peace 21 Sept. ◊

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby New Tobin Paradigm » Mon, 04 Dec 2017, 07:31

If he does it right (assuming it isn't jetpack or some webextension hybrid nonsense or full on webex) that can be accomplished this very moment with Pale Moon still on Tycho.

Would need more info.. What extension is it?

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby gracious1 » Mon, 04 Dec 2017, 12:53

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:Would need more info.. What extension is it?


All of these are by the same developer, and they already published at the Pale Moon Add-ons Site:
Back to Top v10.0
CLEO v10.0
FEBE v10.0
OPIE v10.0
OPIE2 v10.0
Paste Email v10.0
Paste Email Plus v10.0

The versions published at AMO (e.g. FEBE) work with pre-Quantum Fx/Waterfox/Basilisk.

AFAIK these are completely XUL/XPCOM, no JetPack. I know for sure they are absolutely not WebExtensions.
Image“We look forward to the time when the Power of Love will replace the Love of Power. Then will our world know the blessings of peace.” ― Wm. Ewart Gladstone ◊ Int'l Day of Peace 21 Sept. ◊

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby New Tobin Paradigm » Mon, 04 Dec 2017, 13:22

There should be zero reason why he can't do it all in one version.. Yeah I am familiar with some of them.. There may be some special cases for the Pale Moon UI or Tycho until we get it onto UXP but it should be super easy to conditionally deal with divergent behavior in the UI or platform of these applications.. Shouldn't be too bad though.

The real issue is that there isn't an add-ons site for Basilisk and if there was to be one it wouldn't be operational till the latter half of next year given my intended schedule and workload for 2018.

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby Sun42 » Mon, 04 Dec 2017, 22:39

gracious1 wrote:One extension developer who is supporting Pale Moon expressed a desire to be able to release a one-size-fits-all version that works in all current XUL browsers. Right now, he has to make one for (pre-Quantum) Fx/Waterfox/Basilisk and one for Pale Moon.


Indeed he did - after I inquired about it. The question was about if amo's FEBE only target Firefox or UXP/Basilisk and other forks, too.

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:There should be zero reason why he can't do it all in one version.


Imho Chuck Baker agrees - It's just that at the moment the amo version still works for ESR/Basilisk/Waterfox, and Pale Moon has a dedicated addon site - so there's no pressing need to unify now. After Pale Moon switches to UXP, unified extensions are probably easier write for all xul browsers anyway, the number of dev targets are reduced and Basilisk/Pale Moon will be closer than they are now.
Last edited by Sun42 on Mon, 04 Dec 2017, 22:46, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby New Tobin Paradigm » Mon, 04 Dec 2017, 22:43

For Platform this may be true but realize that Basilisk and Pale Moon share a VERY different user interface and that as much as platform is dependent on multi-application extensions. It has to be accounted for in any event.. When you throw Mozilla's abandoned older versions and Waterfox in the mix you still have to account for differences because while the number of platforms goes down to three the number of base application UIs is still two to three.

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby Sun42 » Mon, 04 Dec 2017, 22:53

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:For Platform this may be true but realize that Basilisk and Pale Moon share a VERY different user interface and that as much as platform is dependent on multi-application extensions. It has to be accounted for in any event.. When you throw Mozilla's abandoned older versions and Waterfox in the mix you still have to account for differences because while the number of platforms goes down to three the number of base application UIs is still two to three.


Well, I understand Waterfox is and will be essentially Firefox 56 with backports - thats indeed one development target once ESR runs out.

As for Basilsik and Pale Moon after the UXP switch: I didn't realize until you pointed it out that the UI code is so different, from a users' perspective Pale Moon appears like Basilsik with burned-in "Classic Theme Restorer" (though I suspect I'll be flamed by one infamous user for daring to write this :-o). And of course a lot of things still work on Pale Moon that are not compatible with Waterfox/Fiefox anymore, which is why I keept using Pale Moon...

It's very hard to see where the UXP base ends and the UI layer starts, is there some explanation on this?

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby gracious1 » Tue, 05 Dec 2017, 01:25

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:There should be zero reason why he can't do it all in one version.. Yeah I am familiar with some of them..

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:For Platform this may be true but realize that Basilisk and Pale Moon share a VERY different user interface and that as much as platform is dependent on multi-application extensions. It has to be accounted for in any event


So you are saying it is possible to have just one build, but it would have to account for UI differences. This is what I was thinking, since Basilisk uses Australis and Pale Moon uses its own interface which doesn't have a name; in my own mind I call it Borealis in opposition to Australis (they mean northern and southern, respectively).

I think this is very exciting, and I certainly hope that once this platform is perfected that other developers will revamp some abandoned projects (such as Songbird).
Image“We look forward to the time when the Power of Love will replace the Love of Power. Then will our world know the blessings of peace.” ― Wm. Ewart Gladstone ◊ Int'l Day of Peace 21 Sept. ◊

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby proton777 » Wed, 18 Apr 2018, 10:43

Look, I'll be honest. I don't understand anything that is written in these message boards.

I just have one question.

I love Pale Moon. I never heard of it until my preferred browser, Firefox, emaciated itself and took away all my necessary and time-saving add-ons. When that happened I went hunting for a browser that was essentially the old Firefox with the add-ons. I absolutely love, love, LOVE Pale Moon.

Today I read about the new UXP platform, whatever that is. I'm worried.

My question: Will the coming versions of Pale Moon continue to operate as the current versions do, with the add-ons and extensions? (I mean from a user's perspective. Nevermind what changes might be going on under the hood).

A simple "yes" or "no" will suffice, or more details can be provided, if one prefers.

Thanks in advance.


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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby SpockFan02 » Thu, 19 Apr 2018, 03:38

Yeah, it'll still be the same Pale Moon, and add-ons will still work; the main difference with Pale Moon 28 will be better rendering and JavaScript support from UXP.

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby proton777 » Thu, 19 Apr 2018, 10:30

New Tobin Paradigm and SpockMan02: Thank you both. This is great news.

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Re: One Unified XUL Platform to serve them all

Unread postby New Tobin Paradigm » Thu, 19 Apr 2018, 10:33

No problem.

We are all working really hard to make sure that Pale Moon on UXP remains Pale Moon. The more things change the more they stay the same!


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