Question regarding development, Topic is solved

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WiseWolf
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Question regarding development,

Post by WiseWolf » 2021-02-14, 15:18

Two things, I wondered,

I just wondered, for non official builds, can you restore the option to use system libraries?

Also, I am curious why dbus is required regardless of if its an official build or not.

If nothing else, I wondered if there could be an option to disable-dbus in the build.

If no to both, I wondered if you have some specific reasoning?

I don't mean to offend, I am just curious what reasoning you have regarding that.

I would think if it was even a problem you would put something like a warning of, "DO NOT ASK FOR HELP IF YOU DO THIS!"

I mean, if you think it is a bad idea that you don't want to support.

That being said, I am curious to hear your thoughts whether they crass or not.

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Re: Question regarding development,

Post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2021-02-14, 15:27

Using unofficial branding or whatever branding you want as long as it isn't ours is a fundamental right for any MPL covered code. However, if you try to misrepresent it as being affiliated or related to us in some way that can cause user confusion in such an instance like the MSFN Hackers do then you are gonna be subject to us defending our brand integrity.

The MOST you can get away with in good faith is mentioning (as long as it isn't a major selling point or the tag line) is that it is based on Pale Moon or Basilisk when describing what your thing is. But you may NOT call it Pale Moon or use that as a package name or market it as such.

Just properly fork it. I might even help you if you aren't intentionally being thick or deceptive.
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Re: Question regarding development,

Post by WiseWolf » 2021-02-14, 15:43

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:
2021-02-14, 15:27
Using unofficial branding or whatever branding you want as long as it isn't ours is a fundamental right for any MPL covered code. However, if you try to misrepresent it as being affiliated or related to us in some way that can cause user confusion in such an instance like the MSFN Hackers do then you are gonna be subject to us defending our brand integrity.

The MOST you can get away with in good faith is mentioning (as long as it isn't a major selling point or the tag line) is that it is based on Pale Moon or Basilisk when describing what your thing is. But you may NOT call it Pale Moon or use that as a package name or market it as such.

Just properly fork it. I might even help you if you aren't intentionally being thick or deceptive.
Ah, okay, i was mostly asking, because using non standard libraries I heard was removed. And no, i wasn't planning to use your branding or anything shady like that. I have much respect for this project. My only request, is that you add those options. I myself, don't plan to do the forking myself, I have an ally, who is thinking the same way as me. I am doing this without his knowledge more or less. You are familiar, with Iceweasel-uxp, Icedove-uxp, etc right?

He is the dev I speak of.
Sometimes i do admit i am thick headed, so i apologize, but yeah, even if you would add those options above, I would very much appreciate it.

Incidentally, it seems to work without dbus in the operating system I using right now, aka Hyperbola.

if nothing else, can you just add the non system library option only for non branded builds.

Thank you for hearing my case btw, appreciated many times over.

just a small edit btw, --disabling dbus, etc... only works, because of workarounds. that was why i asked. Just to make it easier, heh.

But yeah, i just want cooperation if possible.

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Re: Question regarding development,

Post by Moonchild » 2021-02-14, 16:32

Well I haven't heard from Luke in an age now. Good to know he's still alive.

As for using system libraries, for many you simply can't do that any more unless you patch the tree to build it back in for whatever fork you're building. We have no intention of further supporting it for critical libraries.
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Re: Question regarding development,

Post by WiseWolf » 2021-02-14, 20:23

Moonchild wrote:
2021-02-14, 16:32
Well I haven't heard from Luke in an age now. Good to know he's still alive.

As for using system libraries, for many you simply can't do that any more unless you patch the tree to build it back in for whatever fork you're building. We have no intention of further supporting it for critical libraries.
Alright, I just wondered, your reasoning, I am surprised, that its a huge ordeal like that, but okay. I assume both things are out of the question then?

Just was wondering is all. no system libraries I understand though. Didn't know you haven't heard from him in a while, that sounds a bit odd.

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Re: Question regarding development,

Post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2021-02-14, 20:35

Not really since he was removed from the BinOC IRC Channel after stringing us along for months on WebComponents porting for which he had no idea how he was gonna complete it. He did do a lot of work but he claims he doesn't even know what all he did and strung us along for months after his last batch of Mozilla patches until I put him on the spot and he admitted it.

I was not upset that he wasn't capable of completing the work but that he would routinely ignore my instructions, not give me critical data, dismissing the critical nature of why it was needed, and kept quiet for months about not being able to complete it. Then he concluded that me being upset about all this was just drama and I kickbanned his ass from my channel for being deceptive and uncooperative.

Since then he hasn't done shit except chime in a few times.
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Re: Question regarding development,

Post by WiseWolf » 2021-02-14, 20:46

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:
2021-02-14, 20:35
Not really since he was removed from the BinOC IRC Channel after stringing us along for months on WebComponents porting for which he had no idea how he was gonna complete it. He did do a lot of work but he claims he doesn't even know what all he did and strung us along for months after his last batch of Mozilla patches until I put him on the spot and he admitted it.

I was not upset that he wasn't capable of completing the work but that he would routinely ignore my instructions, not give me critical data, dismissing the critical nature of why it was needed, and kept quiet for months about not being able to complete it. Then he concluded that me being upset about all this was just drama and I kickbanned his ass from my channel for being deceptive and uncooperative.

Since then he hasn't done shit except chime in a few times.
I don't think he meant to be either of those things, that being said, maybe it was too much for anyone to do on their own. I recall talking to him and he said that he had told you he needed help to do so. I don't know much about this, but yeah, I think he might have lost faith in you or something. It is possible that's why he stayed quiet, he felt it was way above his head and some strife here and there. I don't know for sure any of this though, but regardless, he seems like a nice person.
That being all said, I really don't think he was deceptive whatsoever. I don't know shit about programming languages. So there's that so maybe cooperation wasn't something he knew how to do regarding this.

I wish you weren't both against each other, but meh... It is what it is I suppose.

Either way, I guess this can be locked if there is no further purpose. Though I would like to know my final question's answer from Moonchild.

a --disable-dbus option for unbranded builds only, if yes, sounds good, if no, it is what it is.

Though I am still glad you guys have kept the original intent of firefox alive. Before they became this beastly corporation obsessed with greed and more so with google. Take it for whatever that is worth.

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Re: Question regarding development,

Post by coffeebreak » 2021-02-18, 13:16

There is a sticky in the general Development subforum about this:
About the use of system libraries

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Re: Question regarding development,

Post by WiseWolf » 2021-02-18, 15:48

coffeebreak wrote:
2021-02-18, 13:16
There is a sticky in the general Development subforum about this:
About the use of system libraries
Ah okay, then I will assume this is solved and my answer is no on both. ;)

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