Sync data lost after period of inactivity. Topic is solved

Anything to do with the Pale Moon Sync service.

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Krysalia
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Sync data lost after period of inactivity.

Unread postby Krysalia » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 03:29

Hi, I've tried to get my sync bookmarks, sessions, tabs etc back on my new PC and sync doesn't work.
I've tried to see if it was that problem about .net > .org in the about:config and it's not, my palemoon is already set on the .org...

I can't find any of my old add-ons like "sessions manager", I made some saves of the sessions but I can't use them if there's no sync of my addons ?

I've changed my PC in the last 1/3 of april and it took time for me to re sync it, is my sync data completely lost or something ?

(sorry for my bad english, it's not my first language)

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Re: Sync stopped working! Help!  Topic is solved

Unread postby Moonchild » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 10:51

If you used Sync as a backup server for your data, and did not sync for a long time, your data will have been purged from the server.

See http://www.palemoon.org/sync/
What is Pale Moon Sync not for?
...
  • It's not for backing up your data to the server or restoring from it

and http://www.palemoon.org/sync/terms.shtml
Limited time storage:
This Service will retain User Data only for a limited time. If the Service is not actively used by a user, the User Data stored on the server may be removed at our discretion to free up server resources for other users who actively use the Service.
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Re: Sync stopped working! Help!

Unread postby Krysalia » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 11:26

uhh ? i'm quite shocked. I did not use this "as a back up server". I used it to transfer my data to my new PC before shutting down my old central unit. then I had troubles to make the new one work, I had health issues too, so I was only able to retreive my profile for palemoon these days, a little more than... one month after I synced my profile.

I was never warned that my profile could be erased in any way during the process, if I knew this i would have asked somebody to save it while I could not do it myself.

that's such a shame oO. So I've lost everything, passwords, bookmarks, tabs, old sessions, every preference, all my add-ons and their preferences. gosh, that's shameful methods.
I could have been in a away trip for two months and have my PC stolen at my place without knowing it, as it happened to a friend of mine a few years ago.
how on earth is this an acceptable policy to erase everything without notice after one month with no prior warning oO...

and before you tell me "you should have had back ups". I HAD. I've made some back ups of everything i could so I may have my bookmarks (I don't use them often). But i've made sessions back ups and I can't use them anymore because of the versions issues, it can't even install the add-on. And if I find a version acceptable for the session saver add-on, it's not compatible with tab mix plus so it's not usable oO.
and all this in o n e m o n t h.
Last edited by Krysalia on Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 11:51, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sync stopped working! Help!

Unread postby Moonchild » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 13:05

I'm sorry but it is not our responsibility to safeguard your data from loss.

By not immediately synchronizing the new machine you effectively used Sync as a storage/backup service.

Sync is designed to be used as a (near-immediate) synchronization service between active instances of the browser, not for storage or recovery. Since you agreed to these terms when you registered your sync account it is entirely your mistake for using the service for a purpose other than intended, regardless of personal circumstances.

Krysalia wrote:I could have been in a away trip for two months and have my PC stolen at my place without knowing it, as it happened to a friend of mine a few years ago.
how on earth is this an acceptable policy to erase everything without notice after one month with no prior warning oO...

If your "away trip" would also mean you would not actively use Sync in those two months, then your data would have been removed from the server just the same. That is the definition of limited time storage as defined in the terms.
If the policy to store your data for a limited time only was not acceptable, then you should not have agreed to the terms and should not have used the service.
Improving Mozilla code: You know you're on the right track with code changes when you spend the majority of your time deleting code.

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Re: Sync data lost after period of inactivity.

Unread postby franstam » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 13:12

@Krysalia, sorry to hear that.

In the future consider using FEBE to do a backup of your browser data, and store it in a safe location periodically. FEBE is the actual bomb in backing up as it backs up the actual extension .xpi file as well, so you can reinstall the exact version that you had, preventing version screwups.

Hope this helps.
doesn't tabmix plus have a session saver function builtin to the addon itself?
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Re: Sync data lost after period of inactivity.

Unread postby Krysalia » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 17:29

to moonchild > "since you signed the terms". Okay so you're just covering the fact that it is unacceptable that such a term would not be presented to the user in other clear ways tha burried in the terms. that's so inelegant and petty.

how on earth could I guess that, to the contrary of any other sync service I've ever encountered, my data wasn't safe at all and that it could be erased in less than a month if I had troubles to sync right away ?
Was it very difficult to put just a red LINE on the subscription page : "be aware to sync your data at least every [x] days period or it will be erased" ?
Of course no it was not difficult. But the service would have seem way less compliant and useful. I clearly remember the ad lines about "recovering everything" on every machines", that the process was safe and simple blahblahblah. not a word about this destructive restriction exept this mention burried in the terms, it's so shameful oO.

Also, saying "you just had to read the small prints, sorry but not sorry" is a very shitty way to answer to a user who had a huge loss of data because of the lack of clarity and transparency.

Franstam > i'll look about FEBE thanks a lot! Tab mix plus has a session saver function but I had the session saver extension too, wich is more precise, that is, when it works though. and I made it to work with tab mix plus for the back ups. So now the back up need both to be fully usable and it's quite a nightmare. I'll lose so much time with this. I already lost two hours late last night to search and dowload and test versions to find compatibilities. If I'm about to lose so much of this time I'll probably switch every thing I retreive to vivaldi, wich has no problem to sync whatsoever. I must say I do not feel safe using palemoon anymore. (and I used it and defended it since years :/ but there it is, I'm done).

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Re: Sync data lost after period of inactivity.

Unread postby Moonchild » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 18:21

Krysalia wrote:how on earth could I guess that, to the contrary of any other sync service I've ever encountered, my data wasn't safe at all


No guessing is involved. Everything is stated in clear and simple terms on the Pale Moon sync web page.

Krysalia wrote:such a term would not be presented to the user

It is, and you checked the box that you agreed to it when creating your account. As with any other service registration, those links are clickable.
tos1.png


Krysalia wrote:Also, saying "you just had to read the small prints, sorry but not sorry" is a very shitty way to answer to a user who had a huge loss of data because of the lack of clarity and transparency.


Maybe being told it was your own fault hurts, but please don't try to lay blame on others because of it. Talk about shameful.

Please tell me what is not clear about the following, clearly stated in no small print on the website. Of note: nowhere does it say it is for anything but synchronization, and it specifically states it's not meant for backing up/restoring:

www.palemoon.org/sync wrote:Pale Moon Sync service
The Pale Moon Sync service is a Sync 1.1 (Weave-based) synchronization service for Pale Moon browser users.
It allows the synchronization of data between Pale Moon browser instances using an e-mail and password as account credentials.
This service is governed by the Pale Moon Sync Terms of Service and Privacy Policy.

To check on the server status, please go here: https://pmsync.palemoon.org/status/

What is Pale Moon Sync for?

  • Synchronizing data between different desktop/laptop computers
  • Synchronizing data between desktop.laptop computers and mobile devices (e.g. tablet, phone)
  • Synchronizing data between Pale Moon on different operating systems

When talking about "data", this comprises, by your choice:

  • Bookmarks
  • Open tabs
  • Browsing history
  • Form history
  • Passwords
  • Preferences (limited subset)

What is Pale Moon Sync not for?

Pale Moon Sync is a free courtesy service with no guarantees of availability.
It has not been designed with other use than synchronization in mind, therefore:

  • It's not for backing up your data to the server or restoring from it
  • It's not for corporate/high-availability use. There is no SLA or up-time guarantee.
  • It's not for synchonizing data between Pale Moon and other browsers
    (although it's possible to sync with other Weave 1.1 compatible clients, the Pale Moon server is not calculated on the required capacity for additional clients. If you are a client developer and want to use the Pale Moon server in lieu of setting up your own, you must contact me to discuss details)
  • It's not for anything that would be in violation of the Terms of Service.
Improving Mozilla code: You know you're on the right track with code changes when you spend the majority of your time deleting code.

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Re: Sync data lost after period of inactivity.

Unread postby Krysalia » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 18:51

it's only in the terms, but it is a clearly strong and destructive restriction and you should warn the user somewhere more blatant and clear. Do not worry, you are legally covered. But you are inelegant and blunt. that's shitty behavior, period.

and then again, any other sync service I could encounter since I use those kind of things keeps the data to be used when synced, it doesn't put a threat like that on the data in such a short time, that's the whole point. The fact that the data could be erased after something as short as "one month" or even shorter is not obvious to say the least (and any person I've talked about that since yesterday is as shocked as I am).


so then again, congrats, you are legally covered. but if that's the only thing that matters to you when talking with a faithful user of palemoon for years, who suffered a loss of data because of the lack of clarity and transparency about a huge restriction of the program, I'm glad that I won't use palemoon anymore.

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Re: Sync data lost after period of inactivity.

Unread postby Moonchild » Fri, 22 Jun 2018, 19:00

Making assumptions based on other unrelated services is clearly risky. Once again, 1 minute skimming over the web page would have given you all the info needed.

Congratulations, you've proven once again that I should have doubts about even running courtesy services any longer.

Also, continuing your personal attack against me for pointing out your own mistake to you has gone on long enough. I'm sure you won't miss your Pale Moon forum account.
Improving Mozilla code: You know you're on the right track with code changes when you spend the majority of your time deleting code.

"If you want to build a better world for yourself, you have to be willing to build one for everybody." -- Coyote Osborne


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