Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Talk about code development, features, specific bugs, enhancements, patches, and similar things.
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Mercury

Re: Building Palemoon 27 for XP

Unread post by Mercury » 2018-03-13, 17:49

Pale Moon is a trademarked name. Only Moonchild (as either M.C. Straver or Moonchild Productions) can authorize a web browser to be called "Pale Moon". If he did not authorize it, it isn't Pale Moon. It's a bootleg, and illegal in most places in the world.

It's weird to be agreeing with Tobin, but he's right. I can't believe this is still going on. Stop calling it "Pale Moon for XP". Even beyond legal matters, it's just plain disrespectful.

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Re: Building Palemoon 27 for XP

Unread post by Moonchild » 2018-03-13, 17:57

Asking someone to use the correct term for something or not use the wrong term for something is not limiting free speech, it is telling you to be accurate to avoid confusion.

What's next, you're going to social media screaming "censorship!"?

The offshoots, as of now still unbranded, are forks of Pale Moon, just like Pale Moon is a fork of Firefox, and Firefox in essence is a fork of Netscape.
They are patched specifically for XP and the resulting browser is therefore not the same thing. Same way you shouldn't call Pale Moon "Firefox".
"Sometimes, the best way to get what you want is to be a good person." -- Louis Rossmann
"Seek wisdom, not knowledge. Knowledge is of the past; wisdom is of the future." -- Native American proverb
"Linux makes everything difficult." -- Lyceus Anubite

visionhelp

Re: Building Palemoon 27 for XP

Unread post by visionhelp » 2018-03-13, 18:06

A bootleg ? So then illegal ! ? !
And Moonchild does not do anything against it ?
Or just doesn´t know, how ... ?
I thought, I did understand him sufficient and adequately.

Sorry, I do not want to be disrespectful.

The talk with Moonchild did make me understand it in this way as I do, but not in the way You both represent it now.
Maybe I did not understand Moonchild quite or absolutly right or correct, but then I would like to ´hear´ this from Moonchild Productions themselve.
OK ?


(Sorry, just reading Your post, while posting mine, I need to think about Your post, OK ?)

visionhelp

Re: Building Palemoon 27 for XP

Unread post by visionhelp » 2018-03-13, 18:37

Forbidding to name it "PaleMoon for XP" is not branding it, it is everyday language, everyday speech.

To want to forbid, to surpress this, this is deny of free speech.

"The offshoots, as of now still unbranded":
OK, "as of now" is new, something has changed. I take it to my knowledge and to my cognizance but I have to insist of my right to use everyday language.


Moonchild, what I have to respect - and this I do - is Your wish:
I NOW may understand, that You absolutely do not want to have Your PaleMoon together with the - now developed and adjusted - versions for XP.
Even without having to knowi why, without having to know and understand the sense, for You.

But to deny the everyday speech is not the right way, if I may say this.
The one is called NewMoon, hmm, but what.
If someone talks about NewMoon, and someone has to ask, what is this, one cannot not forbid to may say, this is a further development - or adjusted - of PaleMoon - for XP -, from which the developer from PaleMoon do not want to be told and not to be represented this way.

May I ask, if You are the owner - and I think so - of the brand PaleMoon, why not deprive the rights to use PaleMoon as basic for NewMoon and the other one, for XP ?


Please, do not tell, if You do not like, but what is the reason, You do not want to be related in the versions for XP, even PM, if You like.


"The offshoots, as of now still unbranded, are forks of Pale Moon, just like Pale Moon is a fork of Firefox, and Firefox in essence is a fork of Netscape.":
But you may say it and You may use the words Firefox and Netscape in the context of PaleMoon.
Last edited by visionhelp on 2018-03-13, 18:40, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Building Palemoon 27 for XP

Unread post by LAR Grizzly » 2018-03-13, 18:43

Why not:

Pale>Dark

Moon>Star

Building DarkStar 27 for XP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eT4shwU4Yc4
Last edited by LAR Grizzly on 2018-03-13, 18:47, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Building Palemoon 27 for XP

Unread post by Moonchild » 2018-03-13, 18:55

**BOOMING GOD VOICE** HERE IS THE OFFICIAL VOICE OF MOONCHILD PRODUCTIONS... :lol:

Pale Moon = official releases = not on Windows XP.
New Moon = unofficial branding = fine with whatever.

For the sake of easy understanding, this thread is called "Building palemoon 27 for XP" -- to be fully correct it should be "Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP" but until some people started making a point of it, I didn't see a point in even questioning the topic title of this thread.

So please, stop making such drama. You shouldn't call it "Pale Moon for XP" because that's not what it is. However, there is no better name yet because people have not gotten off of their asses yet to do the required branding for their offshoot/fork, so for the sake of conversation it is building a fork of Pale Moon for Windows XP...

Now go have some tea. I suggest chamomile to calm your nerves.
"Sometimes, the best way to get what you want is to be a good person." -- Louis Rossmann
"Seek wisdom, not knowledge. Knowledge is of the past; wisdom is of the future." -- Native American proverb
"Linux makes everything difficult." -- Lyceus Anubite

visionhelp

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by visionhelp » 2018-03-13, 19:22

Chamomile is good to suppot the germinability of seeds.
Just I do not like it as tea.

And if somebody tries to "GOD" into my free speech, I get upset or I (have to) leave.

If I am continued to be forced, to have to use "fork" in addition to "PaleMoon for XP", then I have a problem with it.

Then just tell me "GO(o)D Bye". And I will be gone.

For me it is easily and will have to stay for being easy - and others, too - the right of usual everyday speech, to name it as PaleMoon for XP, even when NewMoon - for example - would have quit an other look, as You may say, PaleMoon (a fork) of Firefox and what.
You want to force the people to use the word fork always with.
This force I do not want into MY usual everyday speech.
Here is my STOP to this, and has to do with respect to my - and anyone else´s - everyday speech.

This is a big intervention into my freedom of my usual everyday speech. And I this does not want to be recognized and does not want to be respected, this may even lead to, that I have to uninstall PaleMoon, probably at the latest, when I will be gone from XP to a Linux version, after XP once will not work anymore for some things.
No, NONSENSE, what I am writing, I do not have PaleMoon for XP installed . . .
I have NewMoon.


If a simple tea only could help this all . . ., this would be nice.
Last edited by visionhelp on 2018-03-13, 19:25, edited 1 time in total.

New Tobin Paradigm

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2018-03-14, 00:43

Off-topic:
DarkStar is an AWESOME name.. Wish I thought of it.. If you guys band together and call it that I would be so freaking happy..

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Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by Moonraker » 2018-03-14, 00:50

New Tobin Paradigm wrote:
Off-topic:
DarkStar is an AWESOME name.. Wish I thought of it.. If you guys band together and call it that I would be so freaking happy..
Off-topic:
wasnt darkstar a 1970s sci-fi film lol.
user of multiple puppy linuxes..upup,fossapup.scpup,xenialpup..... :thumbup:

Pale moon 29.4.1

New Tobin Paradigm

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2018-03-14, 00:52

Moonraker wrote:
New Tobin Paradigm wrote:
Off-topic:
DarkStar is an AWESOME name.. Wish I thought of it.. If you guys band together and call it that I would be so freaking happy..
Off-topic:
wasnt darkstar a 1970s sci-fi film lol.
Off-topic:
Pale Moon is a card game.. What's your point? :lol:

Fedor2

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by Fedor2 » 2018-03-14, 11:41

I have renamed for some time, seems no palemoon word everywhere but code internal, and there are remaining default bookmarks to palemoon site, do i replace there too?
Newmoon also already renamed. Painting i do not care as i said once, own site too i am not going to make, github is sufficient for now.

Hey when was conducted campaign about about naming basiliks there i see good pictures, i could use it think. May i do this?
Last edited by Fedor2 on 2018-03-14, 11:48, edited 1 time in total.

visionhelp

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by visionhelp » 2018-03-14, 18:09

GateWorld (an adjusted developed to XP version of PaleMoon), if You ever - or someone else - need(s) an alternative name for PaleMoon for XP.


"there are remaining default bookmarks to palemoon site, do I replace there too?":
What will Moonchild Productions decide ? I am very curious.
Last edited by visionhelp on 2018-03-14, 18:10, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by Pelican » 2018-03-14, 19:22

visionhelp wrote: "there are remaining default bookmarks to palemoon site, do I replace there too?":
I tried to edit those to point to my home page which worked but it seems that bookmark also includes the code for the image (useful when offline) so my link used the PM favicon. In the end I decided to simply remove it because my users will not want their users having my home page in their face.

Tony0945

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by Tony0945 » 2018-03-18, 00:45

OK. After two days, I finally got all the tools installed on my sole Win7 machine, an ancient Athlon64X2 with 4G DDR2 RAM that was resurrected last year and installed Win7 on because all the US tax software now requires Win7 or higher (IMHO NOT "better"). So the machine runs Turbotax and sageTV. Sage works on XP and earlier as well, but since I have the machine might as well do something with it.

After many fits and starts, I finally got a build together and tried to install it on XP.

Horrors! When I try to run it, I get "C:\Program files/New Moon/palemoon.exe is not a valid Win32 application"

I think the problem is that somewhere (the mozconfig?) something should tell the mach that the target is XP not win7.
How do I do that?
And out of respect for Moonchild and his feelings about XP, even though I am not distributing this, how do change the executable name from palemoon.exe in the build?


I'm running official Palemoon binary 27.8.1 on all my linux machines and the Win 7 box. I'm running official binary Palemoon Atom/XP 26.5.0 and Feodr2's Mypal on the XP box. Too bad I can't build on the XP box. It's far more powerful, or on the Excavator 16G DDR4 Linux box.

EDIT: The build took an hour and a half (89 and change minutes). Not that bad.

EDIT2: Yes, it runs excellently on Win 7, so I'm really sure that defining the target is the problem. Feodor2, how did you do it? Care to share your mozconfig?
I love your making your mypal build available, but, after getting it to work, I'd like to try modifying my own.
Last edited by Tony0945 on 2018-03-18, 01:00, edited 3 times in total.

Fedor2

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by Fedor2 » 2018-03-18, 07:46

mozconfig is not the matter i use its very default as about:buildconfig points but removed branding stuff of course
Seems you did not changed susbsystem value for winxp
Examine mypal github patches to understand about name changing and other.

Tony0945

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by Tony0945 » 2018-03-20, 14:18

Applied to RestoreXP.patch from your website, Fedor2 and now the resulting New Moon is running fine on XP. I had to install the Direct X 9 SDK. I downloaded it from three sites, Microsoft first. Each one failed to install at the end when it was modifying the registry. But apparently enough got in (all the headers and dll's) that it didn't stop the build. Many thanks. The next step is to examine your Mypal.patch to modify it for my own branding. Then to experiment with build settings. I'm a little confused whether we are using Mingw or Visual C++. I had to install VS, but the build locations and program looks like mingw. I hope "-march=k10" works. And possibly "-Os" will load faster than "-O2".

I did see a bug in the top bar, which is also in mypal, but it's also in the straight Linux binary on the Linux machines, so I'm assuming it's a Pale moon bug and will report it as such against the Linux binary. Bug was not there in 26.5.0 but is in 27.8.1

New Moon and mypal run so much faster than PM 26.5.0, which originally was very fast but now stutters and hangs on some websites. I'm sure it's the web sites that have changed. I can no longer log in at all on Morningstar with official 26.5.0 but have no problem with unofficial 27.8.1

Win 7 is just awful! The search tool is crippled and the file layout is byzantine. I know Win 8 is even worse. I recently bought another drive for my sister's laptop and installed Linux Mate. Faster, cleaner, and looks like XP. I really prefer developing on Linux.

The RestoreXP patch affects so many files that I see why it was a chore for Moonchild to keep maintaining XP.

Tony0945

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by Tony0945 » 2018-03-21, 15:23

Bug was in some add-on. It went away in safe mode. I then disabled all add-ons, restarted and added them back. Bug gone.

keith47111

Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by keith47111 » 2018-03-21, 15:42

I am an old fart computer geek who refuses to let go of XP and Vista...I am NOT a fan of Microsoft deciding to track everything we do. I want to thank you for creating this fork off of palemoon...MYPAL is a godsend. Please continue to update...I am big fan :thumbup:

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Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by Trinoc » 2018-04-06, 16:15

All of this talk about what to call the XP forks of Palemoon is all very interesting, but it reminds me a bit of the Golgafirichans arguing over what colour the wheel should be before they start building carts with it!

Be that as it may (and please don't start a long sub-thread about that last sentence, it's only meant as a jest!) the main things I would like to know are:

1) What is the latest version of Palemoon for which one or more usable XP forks exist?
2) Where can I download these forks?
3) If these forks do not already have a portable version, how can I make it portable (e.g. is it just a case of installing the non-XP official Palemoon portable then unpacking the binaries from the XP fork into the bin\Palemoon subdirectory?).

For the record, I'm all in favour of the XP forks having a name different from Palemoon throughout. That way I can have both Palemoon and New/Dark/Whatever Moon installed and/or running simultaneously without Windows getting them confused with each other when clicking on a url link.

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Re: Building a Pale Moon fork for Windows XP

Unread post by DJboutit » 2018-04-06, 18:53

I have been using this browser some with a decent amount of tabs open it is a decent browser here are 2 problem I have run across that need to be fixed

Can not handle Gifs HTML5 Gifs very well if there are a few gifs on this same page the browser will freeze and crash

Does not handle streaming videos very well they will crash the browser

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