Visual Studio 2026

[UCyborg]

Older build tools from VS 2022 are still available, so presumably you can use VS 2026 and compile Win7 compatible binaries.



Even Windows XP stuff.

[Moonchild]

Unless you intend to use new features from VS2026's IDE or what not, there's no real reason to upgrade and then using the older toolchains as it won't actually provide a benefit to the resulting compilation.

[UCyborg]

I'm aware.

I haven't used Visual Studio for me in about a decade now. Last time I did, I used 2015 version. Being a student at the time, MS was generous and gave me the version costing thousands for free. Of course, I probably never used most of its features. But for most of my old game hacking projects, I used MS Visual C++ 6.0 from, shall we say, third-party sources. With SP5 + Processor Pack. It generates lean binaries linked with msvcrt.dll, which you only have to install on old versions of Windows 95, but it's been part of Windows ever since, no extra dependencies.

The project at work is bound to be updated to .NET 10 because of course the end of support for .NET 8 is the total end of the world. /S Guess I'll have to warn on the chance I encounter the customer with NT 6.x system. Even if .NET 10 happens to still work, there's dependency on some C++ stuff that will be built with new toolchain. And compatibility goes despite there hardly being any really good reason for it to go.

[UCyborg]

The latest and greatest...it still happens at times that I edit some code, then start the program with debugging, set a breakpoint and it tells me the source code doesn't match the actual program. Then I stop the program (that I'm debugging), start it again and then it works.

Funny that workplace chases latest build tools...but still uses freaking Subversion. TortoiseSVN tends to randomly complain about directory being locked (by itself) and to run clean up. Yesterday, it even crashed out of the blue and opened their website, which said my version is not supported...but it's the latest. It's possible I don't have JavaScript whitelisted, in case it depends on it to work right.

Bleh! Git (and TortoiseGit) just works. At least I don't remember ever having any random problem with it. Besides being unable to clone that Subversion monstrosity of a repo to Git with git svn on Windows.

More on topic, I didn't find anything specific written on the website regarding running Pale Moon under Visual Studio's debugger. Do you just build it according to usual instructions, run the browser, then use the attach to process option in Visual Studio? Asking because most things I messed with came with Visual Studio solution. Or it was generatable with CMake.

[Moonchild]

I didn't find anything specific written on the website regarding running Pale Moon under Visual Studio's debugger. Do you just build it according to usual instructions, run the browser, then use the attach to process option in Visual Studio?

Yeah if I actively debug code I build and mach run, with the symbol path set to the appropriate objdir in VS if it needs that (usually it finds them automatically), and attach the debugger to the running process. It just works grabbing any crashes or breakpoints. I use the same method investigating reported crash addresses (but then of course running release and pointing symbols paths to the release objdir)

[UCyborg]

Ok, one more question regarding ATL and MFC. They seem to come in two variants, with and without Spectre mitigations. Generally, do you decide to use one or another? I'm puzzled by the part of instructions for building Pale Moon dealing with 32-bit build, where for ATL, it says to install both.

[UCyborg]

Was my question my stupid? Not having dug any deeper into those libraries yet, I'd assume there's a choice between mitigated and non-mitigated libraries and developer evaluates most fitting for their project.

Regarding Visual Studio and RAM usage, read Rico Mariani on Why Visual Studio Isn’t 64-bit. And now a decade later.

[Moonchild]

They seem to come in two variants, with and without Spectre mitigations. Generally, do you decide to use one or another? I'm puzzled by the part of instructions for building Pale Moon dealing with 32-bit build, where for ATL, it says to install both.

Not a stupid question, but I did find that depending on my build config it wanted either one or the other, so having both installed just prevents missing build prerequisites. I didn't dig deeper into why at the time.

[UCyborg]

2026 still has a mind of its own, sometimes it suggests banal auto-completions if you've been applying multiple similar statements in different places in the file. I got funny bug while turning the upside down the database backend in software at work, when I wanted to continue execution from the breakpoint, it said it can't apply code changes due to internal error, even though there were no changes, the thing was built after cleaning solution. I just restarted VS at that point.

Something that applies to 2022 as well as 2026, DO NOT have the solution opened while performing operations through TortoiseGit that change files in the repository. Visual Studio may cause files to be randomly deleted during rebasing, they you'll wonder while editing commits why file X is suddenly shown as missing. I know Git is integrated in Visual Studio, though I haven't quite got accustomed to its interface. Plus, if I'm not mistaken, there aren't any options to interface with git svn, which TortoiseGit has. Speaking of the former, I was recently surprised by the warning saying git svn is no longer supported by the Git for Windows project after recently updating from I think 2.43 something. It still works, but appears to be on the chopping block and they say to use Linux version of Git through Windows Subsystem for Linux if git svn is needed (and want the latest and greatest Git). git svn is a bit of band-aid solution, need to know its gotchas, but it's either that or having no useful client-side features.

Does anyone here use Visual Studio for editing JavaScript files? If so, have you performed any tweaks? Seems I'd have to at least find the settings for identation. Visual Studio Code seems nicer to work with JavaScript out-of-box (but it's an Electron monstrosity). At some point, I installed TypeScript (ESLint, Prettier) in Visual Studio in hope to get some useful hints about the code. But, all this web tech is so foreign me. Maybe there's a way to configure it right, but as it is, everything in every file I open is underlined. Or maybe all code is simply crap!

[UCyborg]

Well, I did it, first time building Pale Moon on Windows. Took about 45 min on work laptop. At least the requirements aren't as crazy as with Firefox where apparently single RUST thing needs 12+ GB of RAM.

Though somewhat pointless endeavor since I know my brain will never comprehend all that non-sense.

[UCyborg]

Just out of curiosity, I wanted to see what happens when you run the .exe built with new build tools on Win Server 2008 R2:

---------------------------
palemoon.exe - Entry Point Not Found
---------------------------
The procedure entry point GetSystemTimePreciseAsFileTime could not be located in the dynamic link library KERNEL32.dll.
---------------------------
OK
---------------------------

[UCyborg]

I found a problem, I can't specify path to the old build tools in .mozconfig.

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export CC=C:/PROGRA~1/MIB055~1/18/COMMUN~1/VC/Tools/MSVC/1444~1.352/bin/HostX64/x64/cl.exe
export LD=C:/PROGRA~1/MIB055~1/18/COMMUN~1/VC/Tools/MSVC/1444~1.352/bin/HostX64/x64/link.exe

This makes the Python script crap out.

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 0:01.61 c:\mozilla-build\bin\mozmake.EXE -f client.mk MOZ_PARALLEL_BUILD=8 -s
 0:10.53 Adding client.mk options from c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/.mozconfig:
 0:10.53     CONFIG_GUESS=x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:10.53     AUTOCLOBBER=1
 0:10.53     MOZ_MAKE_FLAGS=-j8
 0:10.53     MOZ_OBJDIR=c:/Users/User/source/repos/build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release
 0:10.53     OBJDIR=c:/Users/User/source/repos/build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release
 0:10.53     FOUND_MOZCONFIG=c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/.mozconfig
 0:10.70 Generating c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/configure
 0:10.83 Generating c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/platform/configure
 0:13.22 cd c:/Users/User/source/repos/build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release
 0:13.24 c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/configure
 0:14.49 Reexecuting in the virtualenv
 0:15.08 Adding configure options from c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\.mozconfig
 0:15.08   --target=x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:15.08   --host=x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:15.08   --enable-application=palemoon
 0:15.08   --enable-optimize=-O2 -GTs -GS- -favor:AMD64 -Qspectre -utf-8
 0:15.08   --enable-official-branding
 0:15.08   --enable-update-channel=release
 0:15.08   --disable-updater
 0:15.08   --disable-precompiled-startupcache
 0:15.08   --enable-jemalloc
 0:15.08   --enable-strip
 0:15.08   --disable-parental-controls
 0:15.08   --disable-accessibility
 0:15.08   --disable-gamepad
 0:15.08   --disable-webrtc
 0:15.09   --enable-av1
 0:15.09   CC=C:/PROGRA~1/MIB055~1/18/COMMUN~1/VC/Tools/MSVC/1444~1.352/bin/HostX64/x64/cl.exe
 0:15.09   LD=C:/PROGRA~1/MIB055~1/18/COMMUN~1/VC/Tools/MSVC/1444~1.352/bin/HostX64/x64/link.exe
 0:15.09   MOZILLA_OFFICIAL=1
 0:15.09   MOZ_PKG_SPECIAL=sse2
 0:15.09   MC_OFFICIAL=1
 0:15.09   BUILD_ARCH=x64
 0:15.09   WIN_UCRT_REDIST_DIR=C:/Program Files (x86)/Windows Kits/10/Redist/10.0.26100.0/ucrt/DLLs/x64
 0:15.09   BUILD_64=1
 0:15.09   WIN32_REDIST_DIR=C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Redist/MSVC/14.44.35112/x64/Microsoft.VC143.CRT
 0:15.25 checking for a shell... C:/mozilla-build/msys/bin/sh.exe
 0:15.66 checking for host system type... x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:16.04 checking for target system type... x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:16.11 checking whether cross compiling... no
 0:16.13 checking for pkg_config... not found
 0:16.13 checking for yasm... c:/mozilla-build/bin/yasm.EXE
 0:16.14 checking yasm version... 1.3.0
 0:16.26 Traceback (most recent call last):
 0:16.27   File "c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/configure.py", line 32, in <module>
 0:16.27     sys.exit(main(sys.argv))
 0:16.27   File "c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/configure.py", line 24, in main
 0:16.27     sandbox.run(os.path.join(os.path.dirname(__file__), 'moz.configure'))
 0:16.27   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\configure\__init__.py", line 364, in run
 0:16.27     func(*args)
 0:16.27   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\configure\__init__.py", line 407, in _value_for
 0:16.27     return self._value_for_depends(obj, need_help_dependency)
 0:16.27   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\util.py", line 925, in method_call
 0:16.27     cache[args] = self.func(instance, *args)
 0:16.27   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\configure\__init__.py", line 417, in _value_for_depends
 0:16.28     return obj.result
 0:16.28   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\util.py", line 943, in __get__
 0:16.28     setattr(instance, name, self.func(instance))
 0:16.28   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\configure\__init__.py", line 90, in result
 0:16.28     return self.func(*resolved_args)
 0:16.28   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\configure\__init__.py", line 933, in wrapped
 0:16.28     return new_func(*args, **kwargs)
 0:16.28   File "c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/platform/build/moz.configure/util.configure", line 380, in wrapper
 0:16.28     return func(*args)
 0:16.29   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\configure\__init__.py", line 933, in wrapped
 0:16.29     return new_func(*args, **kwargs)
 0:16.29   File "c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/platform/build/moz.configure/toolchain.configure", line 574, in provided_compiler
 0:16.29     cmd = shell_split(cmd[0])
 0:16.29   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\shellutil.py", line 173, in split
 0:16.29     return _ClineSplitter(s).result
 0:16.29   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\shellutil.py", line 61, in __init__
 0:16.29     self._parse_unquoted()
 0:16.29   File "c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\platform\python\mozbuild\mozbuild\shellutil.py", line 113, in _parse_unquoted
 0:16.29     raise MetaCharacterException(match['special'])
 0:16.29 mozbuild.shellutil.MetaCharacterException
 0:16.30 *** Fix above errors and then restart with\
 0:16.30                "c:/mozilla-build/bin/mozmake.EXE -f client.mk build"
 0:16.32 mozmake.EXE[2]: *** [c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/client.mk;370: configure] Error 1
 0:16.34 mozmake.EXE[1]: *** [c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/client.mk;383: c:/Users/User/source/repos/build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release/config.status] Error 2
 0:16.34 mozmake.EXE: *** [client.mk;164: build] Error 2
 0:16.41 0 compiler warnings present.

While specifying full path in quotes gets the path wrong.

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export CC="C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Tools/MSVC/14.44.35207/bin/HostX64/x64/cl.exe"
export LD="C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Tools/MSVC/14.44.35207/bin/HostX64/x64/link.exe"

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 0:01.21 c:\mozilla-build\bin\mozmake.EXE -f client.mk MOZ_PARALLEL_BUILD=8 -s
 0:09.44 Adding client.mk options from c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/.mozconfig:
 0:09.44     CONFIG_GUESS=x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:09.44     AUTOCLOBBER=1
 0:09.45     MOZ_MAKE_FLAGS=-j8
 0:09.45     MOZ_OBJDIR=c:/Users/User/source/repos/build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release
 0:09.45     OBJDIR=c:/Users/User/source/repos/build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release
 0:09.45     FOUND_MOZCONFIG=c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/.mozconfig
 0:11.72 cd c:/Users/User/source/repos/build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release
 0:11.74 c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/configure
 0:12.95 Reexecuting in the virtualenv
 0:13.51 Adding configure options from c:\Users\User\source\repos\Pale-Moon\.mozconfig
 0:13.51   --target=x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:13.51   --host=x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:13.51   --enable-application=palemoon
 0:13.51   --enable-optimize=-O2 -GTs -GS- -favor:AMD64 -Qspectre -utf-8
 0:13.51   --enable-official-branding
 0:13.51   --enable-update-channel=release
 0:13.51   --disable-updater
 0:13.52   --disable-precompiled-startupcache
 0:13.52   --enable-jemalloc
 0:13.52   --enable-strip
 0:13.52   --disable-parental-controls
 0:13.52   --disable-accessibility
 0:13.52   --disable-gamepad
 0:13.52   --disable-webrtc
 0:13.52   --enable-av1
 0:13.52   CC=C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Tools/MSVC/14.44.35207/bin/HostX64/x64/cl.exe
 0:13.52   LD=C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Tools/MSVC/14.44.35207/bin/HostX64/x64/link.exe
 0:13.52   MOZILLA_OFFICIAL=1
 0:13.52   MOZ_PKG_SPECIAL=sse2
 0:13.53   MC_OFFICIAL=1
 0:13.53   BUILD_ARCH=x64
 0:13.53   WIN_UCRT_REDIST_DIR=C:/Program Files (x86)/Windows Kits/10/Redist/10.0.26100.0/ucrt/DLLs/x64
 0:13.53   BUILD_64=1
 0:13.53   WIN32_REDIST_DIR=C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Redist/MSVC/14.44.35112/x64/Microsoft.VC143.CRT
 0:13.69 checking for a shell... C:/mozilla-build/msys/bin/sh.exe
 0:14.09 checking for host system type... x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:14.46 checking for target system type... x86_64-pc-mingw32
 0:14.52 checking whether cross compiling... no
 0:14.53 checking for pkg_config... not found
 0:14.53 checking for yasm... c:/mozilla-build/bin/yasm.EXE
 0:14.54 checking yasm version... 1.3.0
 0:14.64 checking for the target C compiler... not found
 0:14.65 DEBUG: _cc: Trying Studio/18/Community/VC/Tools/MSVC/14.44.35207/bin/HostX64/x64/cl.exe
 0:14.65 ERROR: Cannot find the target C compiler
 0:14.71 *** Fix above errors and then restart with\
 0:14.71                "c:/mozilla-build/bin/mozmake.EXE -f client.mk build"
 0:14.73 mozmake.EXE[2]: *** [c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/client.mk;370: configure] Error 1
 0:14.73 mozmake.EXE[1]: *** [c:/Users/User/source/repos/Pale-Moon/client.mk;383: c:/Users/User/source/repos/build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release/config.status] Error 2
 0:14.73 mozmake.EXE: *** [client.mk;164: build] Error 2
 0:14.79 0 compiler warnings present.

My copy of the repo is in the state before the new Python 3 commits.

Full .mozconfig:

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# Tell the build system if we're building 64-bit.
# Set this to `BUILD_64=` for 32-bit, leave as-is for default 64-bit
BUILD_64=1

# Processor architecture specific build options
if [ -n "$BUILD_64" ]; then
  BUILD_ARCH=x64
  ac_add_options --target=x86_64-pc-mingw32
  ac_add_options --host=x86_64-pc-mingw32
else
  BUILD_ARCH=x86
fi

# Automatically clobber if CLOBBER was touched
mk_add_options AUTOCLOBBER=1

# Application and target
ac_add_options --enable-application=palemoon
export MOZ_PKG_SPECIAL=sse2
mk_add_options MOZ_OBJDIR=../build/obj-pm-x64-sse2-release

# Build options
# Adjust the -j parameter if you need more or fewer parallel build tasks
# Maximum supported without build errors is around 32, and it's recommended to set this to 
# number of cores in your CPU -2
mk_add_options MOZ_MAKE_FLAGS="-j8"
#ac_add_options --enable-optimize="-O2 -GTs -GS- -Qspectre -utf-8"
ac_add_options --enable-optimize="-O2 -GTs -GS- -favor:AMD64 -Qspectre -utf-8"

# Please see https://www.palemoon.org/redist.shtml for restrictions when using the official branding.
ac_add_options --enable-official-branding
export MC_OFFICIAL=1
export MOZILLA_OFFICIAL=1

# Only enable the internal updater if you supply automatic update infrastructure
# and have configured the relevant preferences in your branding!
ac_add_options --enable-update-channel=release
ac_add_options --disable-updater

# Enabling this only offers marginal benefits on first start and may not work on own builds
ac_add_options --disable-precompiled-startupcache

ac_add_options --enable-jemalloc
ac_add_options --enable-strip

ac_add_options --disable-parental-controls
ac_add_options --disable-accessibility
ac_add_options --disable-gamepad
ac_add_options --disable-webrtc

ac_add_options --enable-av1

export CC="C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Tools/MSVC/14.44.35207/bin/HostX64/x64/cl.exe"
export LD="C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Tools/MSVC/14.44.35207/bin/HostX64/x64/link.exe"
WIN32_REDIST_DIR="C:/Program Files/Microsoft Visual Studio/18/Community/VC/Redist/MSVC/14.44.35112/$BUILD_ARCH/Microsoft.VC143.CRT"
WIN_UCRT_REDIST_DIR="C:/Program Files (x86)/Windows Kits/10/Redist/10.0.26100.0/ucrt/DLLs/$BUILD_ARCH"

I initially used $BUILD_ARCH for the final subfolder before cl.exe / link.exe, just simplified it for testing.

[UCyborg]

I ended up making a symlink on C:\ (C:\VC) pointing to Visual Studio's VC dir and set paths to cl.exe / link.exe starting with C:/VC. Then it stopped erroring out, but was still building with 14.50 tools. I ran TortoiseGit's clean up, reinstated .mozconfig and things seemed to have gone through as intended.

[UCyborg]

Since I'm not quite acquainted with how branches are organized and how submodules work in Git...what Franskenstein did I actually build (assuming it did build, I'll see tomorrow) if just cloned everything, didn't change branches and hard-reset the repo to https://repo.palemoon.org/MoonchildProductions/Pale-Moon/commit/0ef7bfc8e5db3e07f672c7ec17de9c47cef61642?

[Moonchild]

You built a dev versions/master branch of a point just past the 34.1.0 release. Not a frankenstein but not necessarily stable or useful otherwise.

[UCyborg]

In the meantime, I figured to do:

Code: Select all

git checkout release
git submodule update