Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

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ascii_elite

Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by ascii_elite » 2015-01-27, 07:58

This thread contains my report of some tests with Pale Moon 25.1.0 and Pale Moon 25.2.0.

YouTube videos in Pale Moon 25.1.0 could be expanded to full screen and returned to normal embedded in window mode and automatically be started again after play is interrupted after the full screen to embedded in widow switch (oftentimes). In Pale Moon 25.2.0 the video did not play automatically after switch from full screen to window mode; the play could then be started manually. The Pale Moon 25.2.0 behavior seems to resemble the Firefox 24.8.1 behavior.
Status: Appears to be related in whole or in part to YouTube's handling of content.

The "Friends" tiles on Facebook overview profile pages (also may be called "Timeline" pages) may display with a black background around the area that has text when using Pale Moon 25.2.0 pr Pale Moon 25.2.1. The issue does not manifest on Pale Moon 25.1.0 or Firefox 24.8.1 or in the mobile version of the Facebook pages.
Culprit found: User agent override results in a webpage that is not fully Pale Moon or Firefox compatible. See the tenth post to this thread.

When attempting to display the context menu in the preferences area of the about:config page, the context menu may be invisible or only slightly displayed after increasing and decreasing zoom level changing monitor where browser displays. This problem may manifest regardless as to whether third-party windows management or monitor management software is running. The problem manifests on Pale Moon 25.1.0 and Pale Moon 25.2.0, but not on Firefox 24.8.1.
EDIT for clarification: A secondary display is needed to manifest the problem. The problem may manifest on the primary monitor, but first must have been positioned on a secondary display. The problem may manifest at any zoom level, but for the problem to manifest, the zoom level must first be at at least the 4th zoom level above or below the normal zoom. The problem does not manifest on Firefox 24.8.1 or much older versions of such as Pale Moon 6.0.2. I have not tried more recent versions prior to Pale Moon 25.1.0.
Status: Still a problem. reproducible always.

The Pale Moon status bar 5.2.2 extension, which are bundled with Pale Moon 25.1.0 and Pale Moon 25.2.0, may fail to be used by Pale Moon 25.1.0 or Pale Moon 25.2.0. The extension does not appear to be indicated compatible in its "install.rdf" file; application max version and min version parameters do not allow for versions Pale Moon 25 series. An excerpt from the Pale Moon status bar 5.2.2 extension's "install.rdf" (end of line characters notwithstanding):

Code: Select all

 		<!-- Targets -->

		<em:targetApplication><!-- Firefox -->
			<Description>
				<em:id>{ec8030f7-c20a-464f-9b0e-13a3a9e97384}</em:id>
				<em:minVersion>24.0</em:minVersion>
				<em:maxVersion>24.*</em:maxVersion>
			</Description>
		</em:targetApplication>

		<em:targetApplication><!-- Pale Moon -->
			<Description>
				<em:id>{8de7fcbb-c55c-4fbe-bfc5-fc555c87dbc4}</em:id>
				<em:minVersion>24.0</em:minVersion>
				<em:maxVersion>24.*</em:maxVersion>
			</Description>
		</em:targetApplication>
Subjective Note: The Pale Moon 25.1.0 browsing experience feels better than than that of Pale Moon 25.2.0.

Installation Note: I had updated to Pale Moon 25.2.0 from Pale Moon 25.1.0 using the Pale Moon 25.2.0 installer.

Other Software Notes:
I am using Windows XP Professional with Service Pack 3.
I am using Adobe Flash Player 10.3.183.90.
I am using UlraMon 2.7.1.0, but with UltraMon title bar buttons disabled for Pale Moon.
Last edited by ascii_elite on 2015-02-03, 02:45, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-01-27, 09:38

Thanks for taking the time to write up your report!
  1. Youtube videos: I suggest you try to use the last Flash Player 11.7 13 (ESR), instead.
    Note: 10.3 and 11.7 are no longer safe to use because of CVE-2014-9163. This is not a theoretical vulnerability and is being exploited in the wild.
  2. Facebook: Everything renders fine here. If you have content-manipulating extensions installed in Pale Moon, please check them for compatibility, since 25.2 implemented a (necessary) restriction on XBL content binding which requires add-ons to incorporate an update.
  3. Context menu on zoom level changes: can you please be more specific? The context menu displays just fine for me regardless of zoom level (I don't have multiple monitors, so if this is a problem only on a secondary monitor, I can't really check the issue). It may be related to hardware acceleration on secondary monitors which is iffy on some systems, especially when running on XP.
  4. The status bar code, being bundled as-is, is not dependent on the supplied install.rdf file (it's not even needed, but included for the sake of internal development testing). I'll update it though, for the hell of it :)
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ascii_elite

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by ascii_elite » 2015-01-29, 00:55

Moonchild wrote:
  1. Youtube videos: I suggest you try to use the last Flash Player 11.7 13 (ESR), instead.
I had used the same version of Adobe Flash Player on all the browsers tested (Pale Moon 25.1.0, Pale Moon 25.2.0, and Firefox 24.8.1).

I retried Pale Moon 25.2.0 on YouTube and noticed that the YouTube video may or may not abort when reverting from fullscreen. I suspect the problem to be than manner in which the way YouTube handles the video parameters, something that otherwise does appear to be buggy.
Moonchild wrote:
  1. Youtube videos: I suggest you try to use the last Flash Player 11.7 13 (ESR), instead.
    Note: 10.3 and 11.7 are no longer safe to use because of CVE-2014-9163. This is not a theoretical vulnerability and is being exploited in the wild.
I tried to find information regarding CVE-2014-9163 and Adobe Flash Player 10.3 series, but found no evidence of the vulnerability for the version series or the particular version used. Adobe Flash Player 10.3.183.90 might be vulnerable to an exploit; I would that hope that the security software is competent.

Unfortunately, Adobe Flash Player updates for Windows XP have been crippled since some time during year 2013. Newer version series than the 10.3 series at the time were quite unstable and the 10.3 series updates were discontinued. The ActiveX Adobe Flash Player plug-ins for newer version series were not truly compatible with Windows XP. Worse still, the 10.3 version series of ActiveX version of the Adobe Flash Player plug-in share data, parameters, and control panel with the normal plug-in version of Adobe Flash Player; wherefore, mismatching the plugins' versions, may be problematic. I would have much preferred Adobe to have never acquired Macromedia (the company that formerly developed Flash and Flash Player). Third-party Flash Player development seems rather poor at the moment. I might be able to mismatch the Adobe Flash Player ActiveX and normal plugin versions by trying to disable the Flash Player Windows system control panel (and perhaps set basic parameters), but it seems more trouble than it is worth.

Adobe Flash Player 10.3.183.90 appears to work quite well on Pale Moon 25.1.0, with no apparent problems (Firefox 24.8.1 occasionally crashes while playing Flash content). The best solution, given the current resources and information seems to be to continue to use use Adobe Flash Player 10.3 and security software that monitors local systems and network traffic (which should be used regardless).

If you are aware of a way to mismatch the Adobe Flash versions without related issue, please let me know.

Moonchild wrote:
  1. Facebook: Everything renders fine here. If you have content-manipulating extensions installed in Pale Moon, please check them for compatibility, since 25.2 implemented a (necessary) restriction on XBL content binding which requires add-ons to incorporate an update.
I doubt that I have such extensions. The extensions I use are not intended for the manipulation of content. I started Pale Moon 25.2.0 and Pale Moon 25.2.1 in the browser's "Safe Mode", and tried to reproduce the problem; the problem did reproduce and manifest again.
Moonchild wrote:
  1. Context menu on zoom level changes: can you please be more specific? The context menu displays just fine for me regardless of zoom level (I don't have multiple monitors, so if this is a problem only on a secondary monitor, I can't really check the issue). It may be related to hardware acceleration on secondary monitors which is iffy on some systems, especially when running on XP.
[/list][/list][/list]
A secondary display is needed to manifest the problem. The problem may manifest on the primary monitor, but first must have been positioned on a secondary display. The problem may manifest at any zoom level, but for the problem to manifest, the zoom level must first be at at least the 4th zoom level above or below the normal zoom. The problem does not manifest on Firefox 24.8.1 or Pale Moon 6.0.2.

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Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-01-29, 12:29

Wrong CVE number, apparently. Try CVE-2015-0311
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roseman127

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by roseman127 » 2015-01-29, 16:25

This wouldn't by any chance be related to another change that happened recently... YouTube defaulting to HTML5 instead of Flash?
http://www.cnet.com/news/youtubes-html5 ... sh-coffin/
http://youtube-eng.blogspot.com/2015/01 ... l5_27.html
The fullscreen mode works differently with HTML5 than it does with the older Flash.
Just a thought

crystalwolfgrl

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by crystalwolfgrl » 2015-01-30, 04:32

Hi there.
I am not a "techie".
I have been using Pale moon browser for quite a few years now. Recently after The Pale Moon 25.1.0 when I upgrade... to 25.2 & 25.2.1 Tabs show, yoono shows, I upgraded the adware blocker that page shows, the quickdial page shows....
BUT NOTHING ELSES does!
I have have to run restore on my computer to bring it back to 25.1.0 like 5 times in the past week. I know its mercury retrograde....but still what is going on? I check my firewall (Eminsoft) and AV (Avast) I think when the the 25. loaded they did "say something" (b/c it was different" My flash plug in won't load. Pages are slow to load now. And I am at the end of my flippin' rope!
One of the pale moon peeps told me on twitter you have to tweat something? add ons, extensions whatnot?
Did I mention I'm not a techie?????
I just want a browser that works. Yeah if you tell me WHAT to reload or what not I will do it. I am signed on to this site no email? No news?
So tonight I upgraded to the newest Palemoon...25.2.1 and had to run a system restore.
Also when any extension upgrades, I lose all my tabs.
The restore the tabs is grayed out.
Did I mention I'm not a techie?????? Maybe you should have a simple browser and a blown up techie browser? I've been using Pale moon for alooong time. I like that it is stripped down FF without a bunch of bs on here.
Recently its just been a PIA. :problem: Sigh.

New Tobin Paradigm

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2015-01-30, 07:49

I am sorry you have had such a hard time with your installation. I realize you are not a techie but more information is required in order to try and diagnose your issues.

What Operating System and Version are you on, which flavor of Pale Moon are you running and what architecture (32bit vs 64bit) and what add-ons do you have installed.

ascii_elite

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by ascii_elite » 2015-02-01, 01:19

Moonchild wrote:Wrong CVE number, apparently. Try CVE-2015-0311
Thanks for the update. I have examined the information regarding CVE-2015-0311. The exploit appears to be well caught by common security software.

ascii_elite

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by ascii_elite » 2015-02-01, 01:29

The black background for text on the "Friends" section of an overview Facebook profile page (but not mobile version) still is a problem. The overview page appears to be labeled "Timeline".

I have not noticed the problem on other web pages. Where can another page be tested that uses the same method as Facebook to overlay text onto an image and display the both?

ascii_elite

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by ascii_elite » 2015-02-01, 22:18

ascii_elite wrote:The black background for text on the "Friends" section of an overview Facebook profile page (but not mobile version) still is a problem. The overview page appears to be labeled "Timeline".
After rereading the release notes for Pale Moon 25.2.0, I noticed that there was a user agent override set for Facebook.

I found the String preference "general.useragent.override.facebook.com" set to a value of "Opera/9.80 (Pale Moon)"; I set the preference to a value of "" and the problem stop manifesting. The Facebook problem appears to be related to an overriding the Useragent String default preference.

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Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-02-03, 13:01

I still can't reproduce this problem, at all.
It's clear that for you, the UA override doesn't work, and causes a page layout issue. For everyone else, this is the best-guess solution to have the most features in the edit box without breaking.

You may want to inspect the background that turns black with the inspector and see if it is somehow a blocked image or similar causing the background.
A screenshot would help, too.
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Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by eskaton » 2015-02-03, 15:38

I see this same issue. I've attached a screenshot.
Here is what I believe to be the relevant/surrounding code from the Inspector:
<div data-pnref="friends" data-referrer="friends_ego">

<ul class="uiList fbTimelineFriendsBoxLarge friendsBoxInner _509- _4ki">
<li class="friendListing friendListingFirst" data-gt="{"coeff2_registry_key":"0418","coeff2_info":"AatX7XCdaiJ9StveeU8trM7S-LPhVySI1jHu5dcE77-R8Df5HKhmo8t08a90V-OriAq-lwKRzxEGvxhRm3NedTqw","coeff2_action":"7","engagement":{"eng_type":"1","eng_src":"8","eng_tid":"100008468589318","eng_data":{"coeff2_user_id":"100001213363935","coeff2_info":"AatX7XCdaiJ9StveeU8trM7S-LPhVySI1jHu5dcE77-R8Df5HKhmo8t08a90V-OriAq-lwKRzxEGvxhRm3NedTqw","coeff2_registry_key":"0418","coeff2_action":"10"}},"coeff2_pv_signature":"254367954"}" data-ft="{"tn":"m"}">
<a id="js_m" class="friendHovercard thumbnail" data-hovercard="/ajax/hovercard/hovercard.php?id=100008468589318&extragetparams=%7B%22hc_location%22%3A%22tl_fr_box%22%7D" data-gt="{"coeff2_registry_key":"0418","coeff2_info":"AatX7XCdaiJ9StveeU8trM7S-LPhVySI1jHu5dcE77-R8Df5HKhmo8t08a90V-OriAq-lwKRzxEGvxhRm3NedTqw","coeff2_action":"7","engagement":{"eng_type":"1","eng_src":"8","eng_tid":"100008468589318","eng_data":{"coeff2_user_id":"100001213363935","coeff2_info":"AatX7XCdaiJ9StveeU8trM7S-LPhVySI1jHu5dcE77-R8Df5HKhmo8t08a90V-OriAq-lwKRzxEGvxhRm3NedTqw","coeff2_registry_key":"0418","coeff2_action":"10"}},"coeff2_pv_signature":"254367954"}" href="https://www.facebook.com/goes.reed?fref=tl_fr_box" aria-owns="js_l" aria-haspopup="true">
<img class="_s0 friendPhoto _rv img" alt="" src="https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hp ... 6d8"></img>
<div class="friendName">
<div class="mas name">
Goes Reed
</div>
</div>
</a>
</li>
I was using Bluhell Firewall, but had the same issue if it was disabled. For kicks, I installed ABL utilizing Peter Lowe's list, and the problem remained the same (even with ABL disabled).
I use Ghostery, but paused it's blocking, reloaded the page, and the black backgrounds were still present.

Here is my info from Troubleshooting Information:
Application Basics
------------------

Name: Pale Moon
Version: 25.2.1
User Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:25.2) Gecko/20150122 PaleMoon/25.2.1

Extensions
----------

Name: Adblock Latitude
Version: 3.0.2
Enabled: true
ID: {016acf6d-e5c0-4768-9376-3763d1ad1978}

Name: Bamboo Feed Reader
Version: 2.1.1
Enabled: true
ID: {b2e69492-2358-071a-7056-24ad0c3defb1}

Name: Ghostery
Version: 5.4.1
Enabled: true
ID: firefox@ghostery.com

Name: GPU Accelerated Flash Player
Version: 1.20
Enabled: true
ID: gpuacceleratedflashplayer@stas

Name: Greasemonkey
Version: 1.15
Enabled: true
ID: {e4a8a97b-f2ed-450b-b12d-ee082ba24781}

Name: Pale Moon Commander
Version: 1.5.0
Enabled: true
ID: commander@palemoon.org

Name: PlacesCleaner
Version: 0.42
Enabled: true
ID: PlacesCleaner@sto.tw

Name: Searchbar Autosizer
Version: 2.1.0
Enabled: true
ID: {655397ca-4766-496b-b7a8-3a5b176ee4c2}

Name: Tabs Always In Titlebar
Version: 1.2
Enabled: true
ID: TabsAlwaysInTitlebar@SoapyBrew

Name: Toggle Proxy
Version: 1.8
Enabled: true
ID: toggleproxy@quirkyquipu.co.uk

Name: Xmarks
Version: 4.3.6
Enabled: true
ID: foxmarks@kei.com

Name: Forecastfox (Pseudo-Static)
Version: 2.2.4-pm
Enabled: false
ID: {624f6983-661a-49f5-9376-3763d1ad1978}

Important Modified Preferences
------------------------------

accessibility.typeaheadfind: true
accessibility.typeaheadfind.flashBar: 0
browser.cache.disk.smart_size.first_run: false
browser.cache.disk.smart_size.use_old_max: false
browser.cache.disk.smart_size_cached_value: 307200
browser.places.smartBookmarksVersion: 4
browser.search.suggest.enabled: false
browser.search.update: false
browser.startup.homepage: about:blank
browser.startup.homepage_override.buildID: 20150122013745
browser.startup.homepage_override.mstone: 25.2.1
browser.tabs.closeWindowWithLastTab: false
browser.tabs.onTop: true
dom.mozApps.used: true
extensions.lastAppVersion: 25.2.1
font.internaluseonly.changed: true
general.useragent.compatMode.firefox: false
gfx.direct3d.last_used_feature_level_idx: 0
media.autoplay.enabled: false
network.cookie.cookieBehavior: 3
network.cookie.prefsMigrated: true
network.http.max-persistent-connections-per-proxy: 16
network.http.pipelining.maxrequests: 8
network.http.proxy.pipelining: true
places.database.lastMaintenance: 1422641549
places.history.enabled: false
places.history.expiration.transient_current_max_pages: 104858
plugin.importedState: true
plugin.state.flash: 2
plugin.state.java: 1
plugin.state.np32dsw: 1
plugin.state.npauthz: 1
plugin.state.npctrl: 1
plugin.state.nppl: 0
plugin.state.nprpjplug: 0
plugin.state.npspwrap: 1
privacy.clearOnShutdown.cookies: false
privacy.clearOnShutdown.offlineApps: true
privacy.clearOnShutdown.sessions: false
privacy.donottrackheader.enabled: true
privacy.sanitize.migrateFx3Prefs: true
privacy.sanitize.sanitizeOnShutdown: true
security.ssl3.dhe_dss_des_ede3_sha: false
security.ssl3.ecdhe_ecdsa_des_ede3_sha: true
security.ssl3.ecdhe_rsa_des_ede3_sha: false
storage.vacuum.last.index: 1
storage.vacuum.last.places.sqlite: 1422641549

Graphics
--------

Adapter Description: Intel(R) HD Graphics 3000
Adapter Drivers: igdumd64 igd10umd64 igd10umd64 igdumd32 igd10umd32 igd10umd32
Adapter RAM: Unknown
ClearType Parameters: Gamma: 2200 Pixel Structure: RGB ClearType Level: 100 Enhanced Contrast: 200
Device ID: 0x0126
Direct2D Enabled: true
DirectWrite Enabled: true (6.2.9200.16571)
Driver Date: 3-20-2014
Driver Version: 9.17.10.3517
GPU #2 Active: false
GPU Accelerated Windows: 1/1 Direct3D 10
Vendor ID: 0x8086
WebGL Renderer: Google Inc. -- ANGLE (Intel(R) HD Graphics 3000 Direct3D9Ex vs_3_0 ps_3_0)
windowLayerManagerRemote: false
AzureCanvasBackend: direct2d
AzureContentBackend: direct2d
AzureFallbackCanvasBackend: cairo

JavaScript
----------

Incremental GC: true

Accessibility
-------------

Activated: false
Prevent Accessibility: 1

Library Versions
----------------

NSPR
Expected minimum version: 4.10.2
Version in use: 4.10.2

NSS
Expected minimum version: 3.16.2.2 Basic ECC
Version in use: 3.16.2.2 Basic ECC

NSSSMIME
Expected minimum version: 3.16.2.2 Basic ECC
Version in use: 3.16.2.2 Basic ECC

NSSSSL
Expected minimum version: 3.16.2.2 Basic ECC
Version in use: 3.16.2.2 Basic ECC

NSSUTIL
Expected minimum version: 3.16.2.2
Version in use: 3.16.2.2
This issue doesn't really bother me. I just thought I'd pass along the info.
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Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-02-04, 01:48

Code: Select all

.fbTimelineFriendsBoxLarge .friendName {
    background: none repeat scroll 0% 0% rgb(0, 0, 0);
    bottom: 0px;
    color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
    display: block;
    left: 0px;
    padding-top: 5px;
    position: absolute;
    width: 100%;
    word-wrap: break-word;
}
That is what is served, and that is what Pale Moon renders. (background line states it should be a solid black box).

So, here's the inherent problem with UA: NONE of the available settings work because Pale Moon isn't recognized in its own right:
  • Firefox: backspace/editing broken
  • Pale Moon native: @popup when adding a linked name doesn't work, neither do any of the other advanced editing functions, since it uses "safe" fallback code.
  • Opera (current workaround): Black background of friend names instead of whatever it is supposed to be
Considering the current UA workaround is only a display problem, it's the least feature-impacting. unless FaceBook provides a better alternative, this is the only solution there is.
"A dead end street is a place to turn around and go into a new direction" - Anonymous
"Seek wisdom, not knowledge. Knowledge is of the past; wisdom is of the future." -- Native American proverb
"Linux makes everything difficult." -- Lyceus Anubite

New Tobin Paradigm

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2015-02-04, 03:43

Could use something like stylish or even greasemonkey to overrride the site's styling for that and make it whatever you want.

ascii_elite

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by ascii_elite » 2015-02-06, 08:34

Moonchild wrote:Considering the current UA workaround is only a display problem, it's the least feature-impacting. unless FaceBook provides a better alternative, this is the only solution there is.
The problem with automatically overriding the user agent string for a site that caters specific and different pages based on the user agent string data is that should (Facebook) provide the better alternative (such as providing a more comfortable Firefox (and similar) version), the alternative may not display or become apparent because of the user agent has been overridden and the client is still served override's different, resulting webpage.
Moonchild wrote:So, here's the inherent problem with UA: ...:
  • Firefox: backspace/editing broken
  • Pale Moon native: @popup when adding a linked name doesn't work, neither do any of the other advanced editing functions, since it uses "safe" fallback code.
  • Opera (current workaround): Black background of friend names instead of whatever it is supposed to be
There are more user agent options available such as for Windows Internet Explorer and for Webkit/Blink based browsers. I have quickly tried some different user agent string overrides for facebook.com and it appears that Facebook serves similar User Experience (UX) to the various known layout engines. An exception appears to be for Internet Explorer (tested version 6), where Facebook serves a hostile webpage that should not display properly in any major layout engine including that for Internet Explorer. By contrast, the most functional and least buggy UX seems to be provided for Windows Internet Explorer (tested versions 8.0). The Presto based Opera user agent seems to be served the same UX as that for WebKit/Blink based browsers.

The following Windows Internet Explorer 8.0 for WIndows XP user agent string seems to result in a page that is functional without the troubles of the previously described issues:

Code: Select all

Mozilla/5.0 (compatible; MSIE 8.0; Windows NT 5.1; Trident/4.0)
EDIT: There is a different display issue for this override: embedded Flash video may show a small white bar over video when playing video that is viewed in the embedded page.

EDIT2: The Pale Moon 3.6.32 and Firefox 3.6.28 User Agent Strings work quite well. No issues previously described herein manifest. Pale Moon 3.6.32 User Agent string:

Code: Select all

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.32) Gecko/20120529 Firefox/3.6.32 (Palemoon/3.6.32)
Moonchild wrote:So, here's the inherent problem with UA: NONE of the available settings work because Pale Moon isn't recognized in its own right
In my opinion, barring some special cases, a website should not discriminate served resources or user experience to web browsers; it should be considered poor design. My opinion is what was taught when I learned web development. In modern times, unfortunately this basic principle is often not followed. This deviation appears to be a side effect of the means used during a large web developer campaign against Microsoft Internet Explorer 6.0; the basic principle was heavily violated in an attempt to depreciate Internet Explorer. Unfortunately, today, this means that browsers that are not a member to the popular few (such as Pale Moon) may have noticeably more trouble with web service hostility.

My suggestion/request would be to not try to correct for the problem directly in the browser (such as by including default override site preferences) because it truly cannot be. This is something that must be resolved webserver-side. I think it would be a good idea to still provide workarounds (such as site override recommendations) and instructions, tools, supplements, or extensions to deploy or implement them.
Last edited by ascii_elite on 2015-02-06, 09:46, edited 1 time in total.

New Tobin Paradigm

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2015-02-06, 09:38

We tried that. No one reads just blindly creates dozens of threads.

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Moonchild
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Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-02-06, 18:11

It needs a string that is as good as it gets with an out of the box experience (OOBE). Posting instructions doesn't help, as Tobin said. People will just find a problem and complain immediately because it doesn't "just work", even to the point where the same people will create articles and blog posts about how broken Pale Moon is. So yeah, that's what we have to deal with when trying to have instructions for people to override themselves for broken websites.

Thanks for finding out that the 3.6.32 UA string avoids all problems! I checked and as far as I can see it indeed addresses all problems, being the only US string with a Firefox engine not displaying the backspace problem - I'll use it for a while on a daily basis and see if I run into anything else with it or not. If others could try this as well, and provide feedback (since I don't use all features of FB) that would be great!

I did not check that far back, myself, because older Firefox versions would give the "unknown browser" layout, and I assumed FB did not have any older UA-specific code retained. Looks like I was wrong ;)

I'll be able to use the 3.6.32 override in the next version by default, if it all pans out OK, and hope FB does not change their UA sniffing code yet again to break that as well.

EDIT: No go, because for a 3.6.32 UA, FaceBook will be "helpful" and nag users with the following:
You may want to upgrade your browser.
You're using an old version of Firefox that is no longer supported and may be insecure.
To upgrade, open Firefox's Help menu and click Check for Updates...
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psychonaut25

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by psychonaut25 » 2015-04-28, 05:57

I'd just like to say that I updated to 25.3.2 (x32) the other day and I'm experiencing the backspace problem again. I'm on Windows 7 Pro SP1 (x64)
Whichever string was included in this version doesn't appear to be working in regards to the backspace issue. Tags still work.

Thanks for all your hard work Moonchild

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Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by Moonchild » 2015-04-28, 10:50

I can't reproduce the backspace issue at all with 25.3.2 (x86), so it's not something specifically to the browser (unless Facebook is rolling out something else that's not working...?) The string entry for Facebook wasn't changed.
"A dead end street is a place to turn around and go into a new direction" - Anonymous
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psychonaut25

Re: Pale Moon 25.2.0 and 25.1.0 Negative Issues Noticed

Unread post by psychonaut25 » 2015-04-29, 07:14

Moonchild wrote:I can't reproduce the backspace issue at all with 25.3.2 (x86), so it's not something specifically to the browser (unless Facebook is rolling out something else that's not working...?) The string entry for Facebook wasn't changed.
Oddly, backspace is now working fine again.