Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

General discussion and chat (archived)

Moderator: satrow

Offset
Hobby Astronomer
Hobby Astronomer
Posts: 22
Joined: 2018-08-18, 21:49

Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by Offset » 2019-04-25, 23:31

https://decryptmedia.com/6719/gab-forking-brave
Gab’s version of Brave won’t incorporate Eich’s Basic Attention Token—a cryptocurrency designed to reward users for the attention they give to digital advertisers, which Torba characterizes as more empowering for advertisers than ordinary web users.
https://twitter.com/BrendanEich/status/ ... 5127347200
Answer this: what kind of parasite forks an open source browser...
...and here is the commenting on Dissenter:
https://dissenter.com/discussion/begin? ... king-brave

User avatar
New Tobin Paradigm
Off-Topic Sheriff
Off-Topic Sheriff
Posts: 5882
Joined: 2012-10-09, 19:37
Location: Sector 001

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2019-04-26, 06:44

Oh this is epic. I may not agree with the nature of the extension but I can respect Gab for getting Eich to expose him self. This is incredible.

Speaking of forks, he won't be happy in 2020 where I will try but might fail to fork Brave Mobile remove his cryptoschemes and get the ad blocker to accept arbitrary filterlists and remove acceptible ads and halfass Weave based Sync into it just to be a Just Works(TM) android browser that can sync with UXP browsers but otherwise do very little work on it.

If you think about it, the Three requirements of a mobile browser that our types of users would want needs to just work which chromium will, needs an adblocker, and needs to sync. It would be nice to have it be UXP based but honestly at this point that ain't gonna happen and since debugging websites is hard to impossible to do on a 4 inch screen .. to hell with it.. We all understand mobile is a companion not a replacement so.. Just Works, adblocker, and sync is what is required.

Since I have your attention on this thread highjack, let me be clear.. IF this happens and I CAN accomplish it.. It will not be Pale Moon branded or MCP produced. It will be a BinOC project with independent branding as it's own thing not a subset to other projects. The only theoretical connection is me and intended Weave based sync client. It may never happen but I intend to try next year.

User avatar
Isengrim
Keeps coming back
Keeps coming back
Posts: 967
Joined: 2015-09-08, 22:54
Location: 127.0.0.1
Contact:

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by Isengrim » 2019-04-26, 10:16

Torbin wrote:The entire point of open source is to allow others to build upon an existing codebase and add more value,
We can sure relate to this, can't we? As well as the original project maintainers calling us names for forking their browser instead of using it. I don't exactly like Gab, but I can sympathize with this.
New Tobin Paradigm wrote:
2019-04-26, 06:44
It may never happen but I intend to try next year.
This is exciting! :clap:
Linux Mint 19.2 Cinnamon (64-bit), Windows 7 (64-bit), Windows 10 build 1803 (64-bit)
"As long as there is someone who will appreciate the work involved in the creation, the effort is time well spent." ~ Tetsuzou Kamadani, Cave Story

User avatar
Moonchild
Pale Moon guru
Pale Moon guru
Posts: 24453
Joined: 2011-08-28, 17:27
Location: 58°2'16"N 14°58'31"E
Contact:

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by Moonchild » 2019-04-26, 12:29

So you'd be forking Brave to add a sync client? Eich would probably call you a parasite as well (since Sync started out as an extension too).
"If you want to build a better world for yourself, you have to be willing to build one for everybody." -- Coyote Osborne
Image

vannilla
Astronaut
Astronaut
Posts: 625
Joined: 2018-05-05, 13:29

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by vannilla » 2019-04-26, 12:39

I really love when people are angry when someone takes a program whose license says it can be modified and redistributed in this modified form, and redistribute a modified form of that program.
And by love I mean that I don't like it at all.

User avatar
Isengrim
Keeps coming back
Keeps coming back
Posts: 967
Joined: 2015-09-08, 22:54
Location: 127.0.0.1
Contact:

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by Isengrim » 2019-04-26, 12:57

vannilla wrote:
2019-04-26, 12:39
I really love when people are angry when someone takes a program whose license says it can be modified and redistributed in this modified form, and redistribute a modified form of that program.
And by love I mean that I don't like it at all.
Agreed. It really goes against the spirit of open source software. I get the feeling that a lot people make their projects OSS in order to be "cool" but without really understanding the ramifications of what it means to do so.
Linux Mint 19.2 Cinnamon (64-bit), Windows 7 (64-bit), Windows 10 build 1803 (64-bit)
"As long as there is someone who will appreciate the work involved in the creation, the effort is time well spent." ~ Tetsuzou Kamadani, Cave Story

User avatar
New Tobin Paradigm
Off-Topic Sheriff
Off-Topic Sheriff
Posts: 5882
Joined: 2012-10-09, 19:37
Location: Sector 001

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2019-04-26, 14:24

As long as licenses are observed as well as trademarked branding is respected which is excluded from those licenses.. Yeah.

Also, I am not denying that I'd be a parasite on Brave Mobile.. I'd totally be leeching off it because it, actually has source code out there and it most closely matches UX wise what I want or more properly would find acceptable. IF it happens and IF I can accomplish it. I would also obey every license stipulation and not use Brave's branding.

MOST of Brave's specific code is MPL and we ALL know I know the MPL backwards and forwards and will follow the letter of it to the ends of the earth! Maybe Gab will do part of the work for me leaving me with JUST finding out how to get Weave into it. Muhahhahaha :twisted:

User avatar
Moonchild
Pale Moon guru
Pale Moon guru
Posts: 24453
Joined: 2011-08-28, 17:27
Location: 58°2'16"N 14°58'31"E
Contact:

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by Moonchild » 2019-04-26, 14:55

Eich calls it "being a parasite". Other Mozilla employees call it "stealing code" -- but in the end it's just taking what is out in the open and either improving on it or adapting it to a specific use and sharing it again -- which is Open Source to a tee. So... they are actually calling Open Source something bad just because they are on the upstream side of it? XD
"If you want to build a better world for yourself, you have to be willing to build one for everybody." -- Coyote Osborne
Image

User avatar
New Tobin Paradigm
Off-Topic Sheriff
Off-Topic Sheriff
Posts: 5882
Joined: 2012-10-09, 19:37
Location: Sector 001

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2019-04-26, 16:06

One can legit be upset and say if a downstream project sucks or is inferior but NEVER because it uses open source code.. Only because it is used poorly. Blame the people for their incompetence and motives NOT the fact that used the open source code. It also helps if you are actually right when you do else you look like an Eich.

Leeching, being a parasite, and stealing code is not a valid claim to be making.

Offset
Hobby Astronomer
Hobby Astronomer
Posts: 22
Joined: 2018-08-18, 21:49

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by Offset » 2019-04-26, 17:46

Just out of curiosity: how much effort is it to do what Torba wants to do with his Gab browser?
  1. change the branding
  2. remove the payments
  3. bake in the extension
And then how much effort to maintain security against hacking? Or is that part mostly automatic with every Brave update, or every Chromium update?

User avatar
Sajadi
Board Warrior
Board Warrior
Posts: 1033
Joined: 2013-04-19, 00:46

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by Sajadi » 2019-04-26, 19:30

So, that means another modified build of Chromium which contributes to Google's anti-competitive business model and further empowers that dreadful mono-culture with Chromium becoming the new IE6? :evil:

Honestly... Brave is just a generic browser with zero redeeming value, so will be that Gab browser.

User avatar
New Tobin Paradigm
Off-Topic Sheriff
Off-Topic Sheriff
Posts: 5882
Joined: 2012-10-09, 19:37
Location: Sector 001

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2019-04-26, 20:27

On desktop relatively easy once you learn how to build it. Mobile? Hard as shit as it has no extension support on mobile.. He would have to code it up largely in old fashioned cpp.

Strawberry Man, you gonna feel that way about my bullshit mobile browser idea if it materializes? BTW I am making that the official codename, "Bullshit Mobile Browser".

User avatar
Moonchild
Pale Moon guru
Pale Moon guru
Posts: 24453
Joined: 2011-08-28, 17:27
Location: 58°2'16"N 14°58'31"E
Contact:

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by Moonchild » 2019-04-26, 22:28

I think the BuMB (How's that for an acronym, Tobin?) simply need to have a high "just works" factor. And let's be honest: Mobile is owned by Android and iOS. iOS is even more closed in that respect so let's focus on Android. What is it? A fast-moving target under Google's wing. If you want something that "Just works" you want to stay away from 3rd party engines. You want to use the Android tools for Android apps, and create your value in the front-end.
"If you want to build a better world for yourself, you have to be willing to build one for everybody." -- Coyote Osborne
Image

User avatar
New Tobin Paradigm
Off-Topic Sheriff
Off-Topic Sheriff
Posts: 5882
Joined: 2012-10-09, 19:37
Location: Sector 001

Re: Gab is forking Brave, and Brave is forking furious

Unread post by New Tobin Paradigm » 2019-04-28, 06:52

The only real value is if I or we can get weave based sync to work else the project has little to justify its existance and to offer current UXP desktop users with android devices over other chromium browsers.

I may need help with that part but once done it would just be branding and clean up of bs features and junk.

As an aside, Mozilla has decided on the time frame for the destruction of Fennec on their side in favor of their new way of doing things Fenix so supporting technology for Mozilla Fennec can't be expected to exist for long after that so chromium based is the only choice for generally easy to maintain mobile browser.

Locked