Quantum train wreck

[Degaul]

I have used Firefox for a long time. It ended after 1 day of Firefox 58. It, to me at least is like using a junky version of Google chrome.
User control seems gone for guys with basic skills like myself. Addon’s, like all things now are malicious, malevolent data miners and behave like Android apps. For instance, one addon/App needed access to my mic/cam to block a pop up or some other damn thing that it had no biasness needing either to do its job.
You want to download a video from a site…if you have an old tiny screen device you can still get one here or there, but even the audio is trash. Copy and paste from web pages, not too much available I could get (like I said, I had it 1 day) Maybe someday after a war or the fall of humanity and we live in Bartertown we might get that back.
I tried Pale Moon for awhile, but I was a slave to extensions and addon’s, so I went back to Firefox. Firefox 58 cured me of that addiction real quick. While the pool for Pale Moon is smaller, at least we can have them and they don’t need my keys or my I.D. to use them.
So I have many computers with many different O.S. If I find one that I cannot remove Firefox and replace it with Pale Moon, then I will no longer use that operating system ever again. All of my machine will use Pale Moon exclusively.
It is a lot of work, but thanks to FEBE, Moz and Password Exporter it can be done. I have Firefox downloads going way back and was able to use those tools and I got all of my stuff like password, bookmarks things like that out of 58, then imported to a version of Firefox before the Fork and then used FEBE to move it to Pale Moon. If anyone needs clean copies of full Firefox (not stubs) where they are compatible with Pale Moon, FEBE and even Password Exporter be happy to share. Just tell me how.
I suffer from early, onset dementia. So, I know I’m doing this the hard way. For others it will be easier, but I just wanted to share how I did it to help others. In time, Pale Moon will be on every machine I have until that scourge 58 is off my all of my hard drives.
After using Firefox 58, I can now appreciate Pale Moon and I have committed to it to the point I deleted all Acronis/ clonezilla backups. Not going back ever.
If something happens to Pale Moon, I’ll go with the professional data thieves AKA Google. If I’m going to get screwed, I want it to be a professional who knows what they are doing when they screw me. This “ethics” be damned attitude of Mozilla is perfect for this new world of money before all other things.
Too bad they hadn’t taken a look around to see what happens when everyone sells out. The world ends up with one flavor of everything in a different type of packaging and then they call those one of each things our “choices.” The cheaper way to say all of that I guess is “greed is good.”
I read that the CEO of Mozilla said something to the effect, that in order to compete, something had to go and that something was their Ethics.
So to all out there, don’t even bother, because Firefox 58 or Quantum or whatever they want to call it is authentic shit. I promise, this is a generous review of that piece of junk.
This post will also appear on Facebook.

[Night Wing]

Firefox 57 is Quantum. Firefox 58 has not been released to the general public. Mozilla will release Firefox 58 for it's users on January 23rd of 2018.

[loxodont]

Welcome to Pale Moon, Degaul.
thx for your personal FF review ... ok, we will not use both of them.

[gracious1]

Firefox 57 is Quantum.

Well, Firefox 58 is Quantum too. They are all Quantum from here forward.

[gracious1]

Hello, Degaul! Welcome to the Pale Moon community!

I
I tried Pale Moon for awhile, but I was a slave to extensions and addon’s, so I went back to Firefox. Firefox 58 cured me of that addiction real quick.

So what exactly happened when you tried Firefox 58? What is it about the extensions that made you quit?

Glad to have you aboard!

[Giraffe]

Quantum is certainly faster than v56 (and the ESR releases) and does use less RAM.
I tried v57 but then remove it and went for v59 nightly; that's v. fast to open and the RAM is about 450 - 500MB - more than PM or Bk but less than v56.

I've managed to get some useful mouse gestures but, apart from that extension, there's almost nothing else. To me, it's barely useable. I'll keep it as a back-up browser - also if a site tells me that my browser is too old...!

[snertev]

Quantum is certainly faster than v56 (and the ESR releases) and does use less RAM.
I tried v57 but then remove it and went for v59 nightly; that's v. fast to open and the RAM is about 450 - 500MB - more than PM or Bk but less than v56.

I suppose you don't use FF 57 on Facebook, Twitter or any other "endless" page.

Scrolling there can use gazillion of RAM without releasing it. Never!

[RJARRRPCGP]

Firefox 58 has not been released to the general public. Mozilla will release Firefox 58 for it's users on January 23rd of 2018.

That's why I frowned at this post... I don't recommend using a beta Quantum...

[Night Wing]

Firefox 57 is Quantum.

Well, Firefox 58 is Quantum too. They are all Quantum from here forward.

Since FF 58 is going to be released by Mozilla on January 23rd of 2018, it is basically a (or in) beta stage (at this time) no matter if Mozilla names it "nightly". I don't pay attention to any reviews for beta software whether the reviews come from companies, tech writers or individuals.

Beta to me means "not ready" since betas are unstable. Only when when the software has been publicly released, in other words "stable", then I look for reviews for the software in question and then I'll make the decision whether or not to install it and take the software for a test ride.

[New Tobin Paradigm]

One of the issues with Firefox Quantum which isn't really anything new but is more blatant right now is Mozilla seem to be taking dangerous shortcuts that are likewise short sighted to gain the apparent or benchmark speed increases. Ones that could open up vulnerabilities or simply instability to win the latest speed race against the Google Chrome.

The prediction of course is once they have either won or concluded they can never win the speed race then they will have to go back and fix those issues as properly as Mozilla ever fixes anything which would of course result in some loss of milliseconds but by the time they get around to that it won't matter..

But of course their whole e10s and eventual rust/servo development strategy is better recovery from failure rather than preventing failure in the first place.. So you will see more and more of this as time goes on.. Beware and be aware of it. This is of course NOT what we all are doing here where speed increses are nice and do come when laziness is fixed but ultimately has to be in balance with stability and useability.

[Sajadi]

The prediction of course is once they have either won or concluded they can never win the speed race then they will have to go back and fix those issues as properly as Mozilla ever fixes anything which would of course result in some loss of milliseconds but by the time they get around to that it won't matter..

I would not count on them waking up. Mozilla "knows" ( ) they will beat Chrome, and they will not stop one step earlier before they have reached that goal (which will of course never work out) to absorb every Chrome user around (and driving away every last real power user which is still on board with them the moment they kill the option to style the browser with CSS).

[Degaul]

Hello, Degaul! Welcome to the Pale Moon community!

I
I tried Pale Moon for awhile, but I was a slave to extensions and addon’s, so I went back to Firefox. Firefox 58 cured me of that addiction real quick.

So what exactly happened when you tried Firefox 58? What is it about the extensions that made you quit?

Glad to have you aboard!

Hi, and thanks. They are acting like Android App's requiring access to things that are not in their wheelhouse. I can't remember exactly which "App's" (addon's), because they were new and replacements for one's we could no longer use. However likes phone App's if you said no to their ridiculous demands, they would not install. I hope Pale Moon never permits that kind of shakedown.

Example, when I use my Android tablet I MUST give some stupid app permissions to have so much latitude just to use the thing that it does not need to do its job, and that overreach is now spreading to our computer browsers? We know already that many of these "App's" are data miner, spyware/tacking ware/adware or some other crap-ware. I take that personally. I realize that most people don't. Most say, give me my thing and I'll be happy. However, to now after conditioning everyone to waive their rights for stupid phone App's, they are now insisting we do the same with our computers browsers? Sorry, that's a bridge to far for me. Of course I'm old.

I think Pale Moon is a step in the right direction. With Pale Moon it just at least feels like its a bit more about my needs, than it is about Pale Moon's needs. I call that being a good cop compared to all of the others who are on the take. Maybe the time has come for a version of a browser that people can buy and then the company stays out of our lives. Keep it simple.You make a browser that works well, keep it secure and updated and that is where our business ends. That is what I think everyone needs these days whether they know it or not. The hard part is getting them to care.

I know Pale Moon has to get paid some how and frankly I don't know how they do it. I think it would be ground breaking if it could be done for Pale Moon to make a clean, retail offering that is affordable, secure and no phone home (if the current version isn't all of that already). I think that would be very attractive to just about everybody except those who don't care about anything except their dancing pig, and Pale Moon has very little chance I would think of attracting that crowd. They will be over at Quantum speaking when they are spoken to, but look at that pig dance so they are in heaven. So be it, but speaking for myself go to hell Mozilla. Sorry to go on so long and thanks for asking. Damn dementia LOL

[Degaul]

Firefox 57 is Quantum. Firefox 58 has not been released to the general public. Mozilla will release Firefox 58 for it's users on January 23rd of 2018.

Thanks for the correction. I think I had just installed version 58, so I thought it was quantum, but it was probably 57. Thanks again.

[Degaul]

The prediction of course is once they have either won or concluded they can never win the speed race then they will have to go back and fix those issues as properly as Mozilla ever fixes anything which would of course result in some loss of milliseconds but by the time they get around to that it won't matter..

I would not count on them waking up. Mozilla "knows" ( ) they will beat Chrome, and they will not stop one step earlier before they have reached that goal (which will of course never work out) to absorb every Chrome user around (and driving away every last real power user which is still on board with them the moment they kill the option to style the browser with CSS).

Yes, that was another thing "style the browser with CSS)" It was like they got a contract with everyone to guarantee all stupid nags and junk could not be stopped, and copy and pate became yesterday the minute I updated that browser in most places as well, because those addon's I had were toast to. Its as if everyone that has to do with the "World Wide Web" had something nasty in the oven for the day net neutrality ended, and the new internet strip mall replaced everything else that use to be on the web. I realize that's off topic, but the stink is there. Google was the god of research tools, but now you can type in smoldering kittens and get a response back like "would you like to buy some smoldering kittens?"

[Night Wing]

This is my take on Firefox 57 (Quantum).

When Mozilla released Firefox 29, that version ushered in "Australis". The head honchos at Mozilla, tried to make Firefox into a Chrome wannabe and that strategy was a failure since along with the Australis UI, they took the customization within Firefox out of the browser. So Firefox lost about half of it's market share.

Fast forward to today. Firefox 57 ushered in "Quantum". If one takes a good look at Firefox 57, it has some glaring problems (from where I'm sitting). The first one is no legacy addons and that is going to tick a lot of people off. The second problem is how Quantum looks. It looks like a copy of the Edge browser in Windows 10.

The problem with looking like the Edge browser is thus. If one goes by Net Market Share, Windows 10 is running on just under 30% of all Windows computers. But the Edge browser among the Windows 10 users, Edge is only being used by 5% of them. That is 1 out of 6 users so if it were me, I wouldn't have copied the look of Microsoft's Edge browser.

When I tried windows Firefox 57 on my experimental laptop, it was laggy. My laptop is a 2012 model HP dv4-5113cl. This means it has a Intel 4000 graphics chip on the motherboard, a 1 TB, 7200 rpm platter hard drive and it came with 8 GB of memory (and the motherboard on this laptop can be upgraded to 16 GB of memory). Firefox 57 should not be laggy. Firefox 52.5 ESR isn't laggy on this laptop.

Another problem is Pocket. On all of my Firefox installs, one could remove Pocket to the Customize window to get rid of it. Now, Pocket is installed inside the Navigation/Address bar where it can't be removed. I wonder if the authors of Pocket gave Mozilla a wad of cash so Pocket couldn't be easily removed.

The only thing Firefox 57 (Quantum) has going for it is speed and that is the only good thing in my opinion. All the other things I've stated above will outweigh the speed thing for Quantum. When January 1st of 2018 comes around, that is when Net Market Share will show how good or bad, market share wise, how well 57 (Quantum) is faring since Qauntum came out in the middle of November. By then, Firefox 57 (Quantum) will have been out for 6 weeks and January 1st is going to show how well 57 (Quantum) has been received.

[Degaul]

Quantum is certainly faster than v56 (and the ESR releases) and does use less RAM.
I tried v57 but then remove it and went for v59 nightly; that's v. fast to open and the RAM is about 450 - 500MB - more than PM or Bk but less than v56.

I've managed to get some useful mouse gestures but, apart from that extension, there's almost nothing else. To me, it's barely useable. I'll keep it as a back-up browser - also if a site tells me that my browser is too old...!

To be fair, I have a USB portable Firefox for those sites that are stupid. Thanks for reminding me about that factor because the problem does exist. The portable is great for those idiot websites, because it does not install as you well know.

[Degaul]

"'ll keep it as a back-up browser - also if a site tells me that my browser is too old...!"

To be fair, I have a USB portable Firefox for those sites that are stupid. Thanks for reminding me about that factor because the problem does exist. The portable is great for those idiot websites, because it does not install as you well know. Thanks Giraffe

[gracious1]

Yes, "beta", "alpha", "release candidate", etc. all indicate degrees of unreadiness.
But Quantum refers to the new web (layout/rendering) engine of Fx.
So Firefox 57 is Quantum, and Firefox 58, whether in beta or final release or what-have-you, is Quantum.
Firefox Quantum is everything from Firefox 57 forward, until Mozilla decides to change things again (Heaven forbid).

[snertev]

Just for the records, FF user browser market share is still sinking in November in the Desktop segment, according to Netmarketshare: https://www.netmarketshare.com/browser- ... 1000%22%7D

[Night Wing]

Actually, FF hasn't been tanking. It has been on an uptick since it hit it's low of around 8% or slightly less. If I'm reading Net Market Share's browser percentage right on their new revamped website (and I don't like the look of the new revamped website), the browser that is tanking is Microsoft's Edge browser. Four months ago or there abouts (August of 2017) Edge hit it's high water market share of (5.66%). Now it looks like Edge has a 3.68% market share (November of 2017) and that means Edge has lost millions (or hundreds of millions) of users from four months ago.

I would like to see how Microsoft's CEO Nadella spins this debacle for Edge in a positive upbeat light.