PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

jb_wisemo · Post by **jb_wisemo** » 2026-01-30, 05:17

After upgrading to v34 and further to 34.0.1, I often see the browser crashing out suddenly when reading up on topics, no error message, it just disappears from the screen and starting it again shows the restore session screen.

In the past, I believe most crashes would come with some kind of visual clue, like a frozen UI or an "Unhandled Exception" message.

Operating system: Win11 (23H2)
Browser version: PM 34.0.1
32-bit or 64-bit browser?: both 64 bit regular install and 32 bit portable hosting a different profile accessing only own sites.
Problem URL: No particular URL
Browser theme (if not default):
Installed add-ons: (On big install): eMatrix 5.11, Web Developer (red dot), Save As Filename (red dot), PDF Viewer 2.3.240, NoiaScrollbars 1.28, MozArchiver 2.0.1, HTTPS always 5.2.27, Google Search Link Fix 1.4.9.1 (red dot), Firebug Autocompleter 1.4.1.1-signed.1-signed (red dot), Firebug 1.12.8.1-signed (red dot), Extension Preferences Menu 2.13.19, Downloads Statusbar 15.2.0, DOM Inspector 3.0.2, Developer Tools 1.0.0a1, Decentraleyes 1.4.3, Classic Password Editor 1.1.2, Classic Addons Archive 2.0.1, Active Stop Button 1.5.9
(On 32 bit): eMatrix 4.4.9, RSM Guest plugin listed as an Extension, Download Status Bar 15.0.0.1.1-Converted, DecentralEyes 1.4.2, Advanced Night Mode 1.0.9, Active Stop Button 1.5.11
Installed plugins: (about:plugins): On big install: MS Office (disabled), On 32 bit install: MS Office (disabled) and out own RSM Guest Plugin 18.0.21097

If possible, please include the output of help->troubleshooting information (as text):

Post by **moonbat** » 2026-01-30, 07:51

Looking at your extensions, DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN. What version of MS Office do you have that has NPAPI plugins?

KSAKS · Post by **KSAKS** » 2026-01-30, 11:39

moonbat wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 07:51
Looking at your extensions, DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN.

In such case it would be good to update it on https://addons.palemoon.org website. Decentraleyes is there listed, deCDN not. But Decentraleyes should not be itself cause of the crashes. I have it as well and it works fine with 34.0.1.

Post by **RealityRipple** » 2026-01-30, 18:07

KSAKS wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 11:39

moonbat wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 07:51
Looking at your extensions, DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN.
In such case it would be good to update it on https://addons.palemoon.org website. Decentraleyes is there listed, deCDN not. But Decentraleyes should not be itself cause of the crashes. I have it as well and it works fine with 34.0.1.

I host my active extensions on my own site exclusively. That will never change.

Gemmaugr · Post by **Gemmaugr** » 2026-01-30, 18:31

RealityRipple wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 18:07

KSAKS wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 11:39

moonbat wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 07:51
Looking at your extensions, DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN.
In such case it would be good to update it on https://addons.palemoon.org website. Decentraleyes is there listed, deCDN not. But Decentraleyes should not be itself cause of the crashes. I have it as well and it works fine with 34.0.1.
I host my active extensions on my own site exclusively. That will never change.

That will make it harder to find by users though, which often only know the addon site. They may not even think of visiting the forums or spend enough time to catch a hint of another place (or two or three or four). There also exist entries within the addon site that leads to other, external, sites, so it is possible. Hence there must be some other reason? Avoiding the addon Review?

KSAKS · Post by **KSAKS** » 2026-01-30, 18:34

RealityRipple wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 18:07
I host my active extensions on my own site exclusively. That will never change.

That is fine. But the problem is I didn't know your extension exists until now. I've simply used Decentraleyes for years. So my idea is maybe add some text to https://addons.palemoon.org/addon/decentraleyes/ that this extension is no more updated with a reference to deCDN and/or add https://addons.palemoon.org/addon/deCDN/ which will just show link to your own site. It would be good for users to see it at Pale Moon website directly.

Post by **RealityRipple** » 2026-01-30, 20:36

Gemmaugr wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 18:31
That will make it harder to find by users though, which often only know the addon site. They may not even think of visiting the forums or spend enough time to catch a hint of another place (or two or three or four). There also exist entries within the addon site that leads to other, external, sites, so it is possible. Hence there must be some other reason? Avoiding the addon Review?

The reason I host my add-ons exclusively on my own site is threefold: strict version control and security, fork license and distribution unambiguity, and the fact that any form of centralization goes against the base principle of the internet. Human laziness is not an excuse to deter any of these principles.

As for not having a redirect page, deCDN is not ready for wider use. It makes use of some unpleasant network traffic interception and injection tools, has bugs with loading fonts, and relies on the source code repository of another extension, LocalCDN, to load its resources, making its licensing and distribution very abnormal, and with heavy caveats about the privacy and security risks involved in loading and running scripts and stylesheets from a fourth-party developer that hasn't even been verified by the third party (me).

Post by **Moonchild** » 2026-01-30, 21:02

RealityRipple wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 18:07

KSAKS wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 11:39

moonbat wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 07:51
Looking at your extensions, DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN.
In such case it would be good to update it on https://addons.palemoon.org website. Decentraleyes is there listed, deCDN not. But Decentraleyes should not be itself cause of the crashes. I have it as well and it works fine with 34.0.1.
I host my active extensions on my own site exclusively. That will never change.

Just to clarify, addons.palemoon.org is there for convenience. It is entirely up to extension developers if they want to make use of it or not. They can publish as they please following their own practices and philosophies surrounding extensions and themes. It is similarly their own responsibility to make their add-ons discoverable for users. If there is enough need for a certain extension, it will be discovered just fine even if off-site. We all know painfully well what pushing for centralisation does to an extension ecosystem, and we've never agreed with it. Asking about something on the forum and being given a link to an extension in response is just as good as it being hosted on *.palemoon.org.

KSAKS · Post by **KSAKS** » 2026-01-31, 06:22

Moonchild wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 21:02

RealityRipple wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 18:07

KSAKS wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 11:39

moonbat wrote: ↑
2026-01-30, 07:51
Looking at your extensions, DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN.
In such case it would be good to update it on https://addons.palemoon.org website. Decentraleyes is there listed, deCDN not. But Decentraleyes should not be itself cause of the crashes. I have it as well and it works fine with 34.0.1.
I host my active extensions on my own site exclusively. That will never change.
Just to clarify, addons.palemoon.org is there for convenience. It is entirely up to extension developers if they want to make use of it or not. They can publish as they please following their own practices and philosophies surrounding extensions and themes. It is similarly their own responsibility to make their add-ons discoverable for users. If there is enough need for a certain extension, it will be discovered just fine even if off-site. We all know painfully well what pushing for centralisation does to an extension ecosystem, and we've never agreed with it. Asking about something on the forum and being given a link to an extension in response is just as good as it being hosted on *.palemoon.org.

That is all fine and I understand it. But in this specific case there are 2 extensions for basically the same functionality. And as mentioned at second post here "DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN." If the not maintained extension is listed here and the maintained one is not, it's simply not about people laziness or something like that. It is confusing and most people will find the one listed here and will have no reason to ask in the forums or search on internet, because the old one still works as well. Question is if it is still good enough compared to the maintained one. If the DeCentralEyes is really unmaintained for Pale Moon, maybe there should be at least some warning. Last update few years ago doesn't always mean its unmaintained, because some extensions simply works and there is no need for update for long period.

Post by **moonbat** » 2026-01-31, 10:01

KSAKS wrote: ↑
2026-01-31, 06:22
Question is if it is still good enough compared to the maintained one. If the DeCentralEyes is really unmaintained for Pale Moon, maybe there should be at least some warning.

It's not possible for the extension site to do that. In general, Pale Moon is a stable platform for extensions unlike the competition, so an extension written for it will rarely need to be updated for newer versions because PM doesn't introduce breaking changes to APIs remotely as often as other browsers do.
Extensions that target online services or sites are another thing, both Decentraleyes and deCDN fall under this category. Both of them work by storing local copies of Javascript libraries and other resources that usually CDNs serve. Since these libraries are very frequently updated, the extension will also have to update its stored versions. DeCentraleyes' author has either stopped supporting Pale Moon (since it uses the older extension technology instead of web extensions and code for it has to be maintained separately) or abandoned his extension altogether for other browsers as well.

Coming to your question, no, because by now DecentralEyes' stored libraries are outdated and won't be loaded since any website using them would request the newer version (or it can break your sites if you've set it to block using the remote versions). It's a matter of design as well - AFAICR Decentraleyes would publish a new version of itself each time the libraries were updated; by contrast deCDN can simply download the updated libraries directly.

KSAKS · Post by **KSAKS** » 2026-01-31, 10:32

moonbat wrote: ↑
2026-01-31, 10:01
It's not possible for the extension site to do that. In general, Pale Moon is a stable platform for extensions unlike the competition, so an extension written for it will rarely need to be updated for newer versions because PM doesn't introduce breaking changes to APIs remotely as often as other browsers do.
Extensions that target online services or sites are another thing, both Decentraleyes and deCDN fall under this category. Both of them work by storing local copies of Javascript libraries and other resources that usually CDNs serve. Since these libraries are very frequently updated, the extension will also have to update its stored versions. DeCentraleyes' author has either stopped supporting Pale Moon (since it uses the older extension technology instead of web extensions and code for it has to be maintained separately) or abandoned his extension altogether for other browsers as well.

Coming to your question, no, because by now DecentralEyes' stored libraries are outdated and won't be loaded since any website using them would request the newer version (or it can break your sites if you've set it to block using the remote versions). It's a matter of design as well - AFAICR Decentraleyes would publish a new version of itself each time the libraries were updated; by contrast deCDN can simply download the updated libraries directly.

Thank you for detailed clarification. And this is why it is in this specific case, where there exists 2 similar extension for something which needs to be regularly updated, very confusing for regular end user, if the non updated one is visible on extensions site and the updated one not. And again this is not about user laziness, but about common behavior of the regular user. And such behavior we can hardly change. And that is what I'm trying to say even if I understand and respect what all the others said in this topic.

Post by **Moonchild** » 2026-01-31, 11:29

KSAKS wrote: ↑
2026-01-31, 06:22
That is all fine and I understand it. But in this specific case there are 2 extensions for basically the same functionality. And as mentioned at second post here "DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN." If the not maintained extension is listed here and the maintained one is not, it's simply not about people laziness or something like that.

No sure in what way you expect us to do something about that. The maintained and unmaintained ones can co-exist just fine. Once there is consensus that deCDN is really a replacement and ready for as-wide use, obsoleting Decentraleyes, we can look at removing the unmaintained one, but until then, there's no reason to do so. Considering they approach the same problem differently, this might not actually be a thing, though.

KSAKS · Post by **KSAKS** » 2026-01-31, 12:26

Moonchild wrote: ↑
2026-01-31, 11:29

KSAKS wrote: ↑
2026-01-31, 06:22
That is all fine and I understand it. But in this specific case there are 2 extensions for basically the same functionality. And as mentioned at second post here "DeCentralEyes isn't maintained for Pale Moon anymore, you may want to replace it with RealityRipple's deCDN." If the not maintained extension is listed here and the maintained one is not, it's simply not about people laziness or something like that.
No sure in what way you expect us to do something about that. The maintained and unmaintained ones can co-exist just fine. Once there is consensus that deCDN is really a replacement and ready for as-wide use, obsoleting Decentraleyes, we can look at removing the unmaintained one, but until then, there's no reason to do so. Considering they approach the same problem differently, this might not actually be a thing, though.

The bold part is basically what I mean it should be done. And according to what @moonbat has written above, the Decentraleyes extension is no more good enough to do it's job. On the other side according to what @RealityRipple has written, deCDN is not ready for wider use. So yeah, it's not ideal this or that way. That is why I thought maybe some info for the user would be good at Decentraleyes (and also similar extensions targeting online services) Pale Moon extension website to push the info to the user. And leave the decision up to him.

The solution might be: such extensions which might be obsolete if not updated for longer time got extra flag. And if some period of time is exceeded - for example 1 year - without the extension update, then there will be auto warning for the user, that the extension might be unmaintained and recommendation for checking forums or internet for alternative solution.

It is just an idea. Maybe good, maybe bad one. The decision is up to you. But I think such feature might help users keep this kind of extension up to date and replace them with alternative solutions if they exists.

Post by **moonbat** » 2026-01-31, 21:02

Please don't quote the entire previous post when responding, it unnecessarily bloats your reply and increases the amount of scrolling one has to do. Unless you're specifically addressing something, it's assumed that you're replying to the one immediately before yours; if you need to reply to a portion like I'm about to do - highlight it and then press the quote button on the top right of the post. You can also reply to multiple posts by doing this with the list of posts beneath the post compose textbox.

KSAKS wrote: ↑
2026-01-31, 12:26
deCDN is not ready for wider use.

It works fine, whatever quirks prevent RealityRipple from releasing it on the addons site, I've not faced any problems with it. The toolbar icon turns green when it has intercepted resources, and you can click it to see what libraries were substituted.

Pale Moon forum

PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

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Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message

Re: PM 34.0.1 keeps crashing with no error message