"Forget About This Site" also removes saved password? Topic is solved

[BenFenner]

My two cents on this topic:

You don't even have to have visited a site to have a bookmark for it

This seems irrelevant. Technically you don't have to visit a site to have a cookie for it either. I mean, are we trying to forget a site or not?

This "hammer-logic" should include Bookmarks too then!

Agreed. For consistency, if the app is going to delete passwords, cookies, etc. during a "forget" call, then it should forget EVERYTHING.

However...

Also: the Forget About This Site function is only available within the History sections, so they are clearly related.

Agreed.

It is very misleading for a feature of the History menu to do anything related to passwords, cookies, or anything other than History menu entries.

I would argue that forgetting a site from the History menu should remove the history entry, and no more. Sticking this powerful, wide-reaching "forget" feature in the History feature set means those of us like me who have TURNED HISTORY OFF (with the exception of cookies), do not have access to this powerful tool even though we have cookies galore. Why can't users like me "forget" those as well? Because that feature is incorrectly bundled in with the History feature set.

Said a different way, how come when I turn off browsing/download/search/form history but retain cookie "history", I lose the ability to quickly "forget" about a site? Because that site certainly isn't listed in the history menu for me to interact with...

It's because things are muddled. Things need untangling. IMO there are three options:

1) If passwords or cookies or anything at all is saved about a site then it gets an entry in the History feature. This sounds like a horrible idea for me, and I weep at the thought, but it is maybe one "correct" way to untangle things.

2) Change the "forget" feature to remove things (and ONLY things) that would make that site show up in the history list to begin with. I think that is browsing only, but maybe browsing + download? This leaves search/form history/cookies/passwords in tact, no longer being "forgotten". This could be a decent option, but presumably this could be an unwanted change for many other users who are happy with the muddled way it works now. Which maybe leads to a 3rd option...

3) Keep things tangled up and ignore the weirdos like me who turn off all history except cookies. They can't take advantage of the "forget" feature (to remove their cookies?), but they probably never used it, nor have much use for it.
When a user tries to forget a site, present them with a list of checkboxes (or whatever) allowing them to decide if they want to remove browsing history, download history, search history, form history*, cookies history, password history, etc. (The history menu would still show the site if they retain the normal type of history that allows the site to show up in history to begin with.)
There are one or two Windows/Pale Moon app features on the tip of my tongue that already behave this way.

Reading more of the thread now, it seems like we're moving in this direction anyway...

Also, when I inputted credentials in this forum, made the browser remember it, then used the "forget about this site" feature, it did erase the saved password, but the form history or autofill for the username still remained. I think that might be a bug.

Eww, yah... That seems VERY strange given how things work now (and how they should work).

No that isn't a bug, because form history by design is not bound to websites. The whole point of form history is so that you enter specific data once and can then use it across multiple sites.

But form history is under the Preferences → Privacy → General → History section...
By the "hammer-logic", everything there should be removable via the History menu somehow, right? I understand now that it is not linked to a site, so probably should not be removed when "forgetting" a site, but then how does one remove it?

*Maybe not, see immediately above.

[back2themoon]

When a user tries to forget a site, present them with a list of checkboxes (or whatever) allowing them to decide if they want to remove browsing history, download history, search history, form history*, cookies history, password history, etc.

A complete "configurator" for Forget About This Site would be indeed great, so anyone could adjust it to their taste and be happy. Something like the "Clear All History" prompt which retains all its previously used settings, so you won't have to adjust it every time.

Of course, I cannot say how much work something like this would require...

[jobbautista9]

By the "hammer-logic", everything there should be removable via the History menu somehow, right? I understand now that it is not linked to a site, so probably should not be removed when "forgetting" a site, but then how does one remove it?

You can remove individual form history entries by pressing the delete key while selecting one (see screen animation attached). But I do think it should be more obvious (and AFAICS there seems to be no menu showing all of the browser's form history)...

formhistory-entry-delete.gif

[Moonchild]

It's not just in the history window as a context menu. It's in the permissions manager as well as a more overt option on any site.

Also, cookies are not set unless you visit the site in normal operation, so no, it doesn't make sense to call it the same as bookmarks.

A complete "configurator" for Forget About This Site would be indeed great, so anyone could adjust it to their taste and be happy. Something like the "Clear All History" prompt which retains all its previously used settings, so you won't have to adjust it every time.

The thing is we already have this in the clear recent history function. Why ask that it be duplicated here...? If you just want to remove cookies, history, site data, etc. then use that. if you want to fully nuke everything about the site, then use "forget".
If you think an extra confirmation is necessary, then that can be done, of course (patches welcome) but I really don't see a reason to duplicate what we already have in the clear history functionality for something that is designed specifically to wipe everything related to a site from the browser. Not doing that would make the whole point of having the function to begin with moot.

[back2themoon]

The thing is we already have this in the clear recent history function. Why ask that it be duplicated here...? If you just want to remove cookies, history, site data, etc. then use that. if you want to fully nuke everything about the site, then use "forget".

We are getting a bit confused, so let's clear things up. Isn't "Clear Recent History" about ALL websites, and Forget About This Site about a single website? That's a major difference right there. I am not sure where the duplication is. I cannot use "Clear Recent History" at all for a single website, right?

Furthermore, Forget About This Site actually deletes more than "Clear Recent History": it clears passwords too. So, that's another significant difference.

Third difference: FATS is not configurable. Clear Recent History is fully so (passwords excepted, but there's the Password Manager feature especially designed for those).

For me, "Clear Recent History" (or "Clear All History", as its window title says) is perfectly fine as it is. My objections were strictly with Forget About This Site.

As for adding a confirmation prompt on a Forget About This Site action: for me it is a secondary matter. I never raised the confirmation issue. Sure, I'd prefer to have the option for extra security, but don't mind either way.

[Moonchild]

I cannot use "Clear Recent History" at all for a single website, right?

Ah yes, you're right.
Doing that on a per site basis does have it kind of scattered about the place.

Furthermore, Forget About This Site actually deletes more than "Clear Recent History": it clears passwords too. So, that's another significant difference.

See above. Effectively though it does the same as "Clear Recent History" with everything checked if you set aside the password thing.

FATS is not configurable.

Again, that is entirely by design because it is supposed to be a one-stop "remove everything" function. I don't know how many different ways you want me to explain this.

I never raised the confirmation issue.

Um... you did

You could attempt a middle-ground, if easy to implement of course: add an (optional?) "Password will be deleted" warning if there is a stored password for the selected Site.

In practice, to make everyone happy, it's possible to slot in a dialog with multiple checkboxes to let the user choose what to forget, but obviously that's involved (and will need to be localized as well) and should also be configurable to not pop up because it will get annoying if you DO want to use the function as it is now. But that might be really overkill for what is in general a rarely-used function. If someone wants to do the work though, let me know and I'll write up a repo issue for it.

[back2themoon]

I never raised the confirmation issue.

Um... you did

I didn't. Just mentioned that Firefox does it, commented that it is annoying and also asked tellu-white to remove the confirmation prompt(s) from his extension! (which he kindly did).

I'll sum up again what appears to be the easier, cleaner, and IMO logical solution: Just remove the password-deleting ability from "Forget About This Site" - no other changes. (We already have an extension for it!)

First result: You align FATS with "Clear Recent History" (everything checked), which makes total sense. They will now perform the exact same deletions. The one is global, the other is per-website. Symmetry and user choice.

Second result: You keep Passwords sacred, as described by andyprough. There's the Password Manager for password deletions. You mentioned a scenario of a user visiting a website, then storing credentials (must be an important website, usually), and then wants to "forget about it" along with the stored password in one go? This doesn't sound very likely. That user should check the Password Manager, where passwords are stored. And they should be more responsible with their passwords than relying on "Forget About This Site".

It boils down to who is more likely to get "hurt": a user applying FATS, expecting to have it delete their password (but password stays in place), or a user who instantly loses their stored password, NOT expecting FATS to do that?

In practice, to make everyone happy, it's possible to slot in a dialog with multiple checkboxes to let the user choose what to forget...

I'm all for more customisation but as you say, it'd be overkill and there are way more pressing issues. I'm perfectly happy with tellu-white's extension and whatever the outcome may be.

[Moonchild]

I can just make password clearing prefable. That should solve this.
Issue #2856 (UXP)