login form user/passwd not detected by logins

[dapgo]

Operating system:windows
Browser version:32.3
32-bit or 64-bit browser?:64

PM doesn't ask to store login /password, but if even login/password is added manually it also don't fill next time that page is loaded.
However, Firefox 115 recognized as it ask to store login/password.


inputbox id: AuthLoginStepUser
inputbox id:AuthLoginStepPassword (type=password)

[BenFenner]

Mine doesn't do this either, but that's because I set it that way in the settings. Have you checked the relevant settings and confirmed they are set in such a way that the behavior you're seeing is unexpected?

[dapgo]

The prompt to store the password should be shown as FIrefox does, but PM is not. And i am receiving the prompt correctly on other pages with login.

About settings there is an option to "fill automatically" but independently of that when you are on the field you should have the option of seeing previously used values.

[suzyne]

My experience with autofill and different browsers is that there is always seems to be at least one website where the login details won't automatically work with a particular browser, while working fine elsewhere.

Are you able to share the url? Without it, I imagine it is only possible to guess at the cause of the problem?

[back2themoon]

Are you able to share the url? Without it, I imagine it is only possible to guess at the cause of the problem?

Exactly. Not sure what kind of help is expected without the URL? Sorry but without it, these kind of posts are practically useless.

[Moonchild]

Not sure what kind of help is expected without the URL? Sorry but without it, these kind of posts are practically useless.

Additionally, OP should already know this. Not their first rodeo on this forum reporting web compat.

[dapgo]

sorry i missed this thread reply.
I didn't specify the url because similar issue happened in different pages, so i thought that it was a known issue.

I can find the url and even others where i suffered similar "issue" but urls that Firefox autofill the login

BTW my logins db contains many logins (500) whereas the FF logins db is much reduced.
So, assuming that no one else is experiencing the issue, I have to check same urls on a new profile

[moonbat]

So, assuming that no one else is experiencing the issue, I have to check same urls on a new profile

That should be the first thing you do before even posting about it. Keep a separate fresh and unmodified profile for testing site compatibility so you will know if it's a problem with the browser vs something your extension/preferences.

[Giraffe]

I keep an up-to-date, unmodified, portable Pale Moon just for this purpose. Easy way to test a site.

[moonbat]

That won't help you troubleshoot problems due to your extensions and other changed settings.Keep another unmodified profile, you can easily launch it from about:profiles without having to exit from your main one.

[dapgo]

So, assuming that no one else is experiencing the issue, I have to check same urls on a new profile

That should be the first thing you do before even posting about it. Keep a separate fresh and unmodified profile for testing site compatibility so you will know if it's a problem with the browser vs something your extension/preferences.

Confirmed that it is generic PM behavior, (independently of the issue being on the form or PM) and not related to profile.
Tested with PM 35.5.win32 and a new profile.

As an example of real URL with a login form that fails in PM:
https://extranetweb.carrefour.es/Portal ... ientesWeb/

After login with Firefox, it asks to store the login, a future reload wil fill the login
Whereas login with PM doesn't ask to store the login, if i add the form info the logins, a future reload fill the password field but not the 1st one.
I 've also added to "username filed name" the name and even the id, but field was no auto filled.

The field doesn't seem to follow standards/recommendation but Firefox manages it well

info about the field not filled:
<input id="fwktextfield-1026-inputEl" data-ref="inputEl" role="textbox" size="1" name="j_username" class="x-form-field x-form-required-field x-form-text x-form-text-fwk x-form-invalid-field x-form-invalid-field-fwk x-form-focus x-field-form-focus x-field-fwk-form-focus" autocomplete="off" componentid="fwktextfield-1026" data-errorqtip="<ul class=&quot;x-list-plain&quot;><li>Este campo es obligatorio</li></ul>" type="text">

[dapgo]

That won't help you troubleshoot problems due to your extensions and other changed settings.Keep another unmodified profile, you can easily launch it from about:profiles without having to exit from your main one.

I never used the launch from about:profiles because I like to launch PM passing the profile folder as a URL parameter and this about:profiles doesn't detect. But after adding folder manually it works fine .


BTW, can you check the previous URL just be 100% sure that the issue is "global"?

[Moonchild]

To the topic here, the browser has to "guess" which form field names are used for credentials and which are standard form fields. It can only do so by way of checking the element names and types to have an idea what is a login and what is not, as, by definition, the browser will not know what is processed how on the server-side.
So if you have odd-ball input field names, it'll likely not recognize it as credential fields and thus not store it or use the pwd manager.

[Kris_88]

I figured out a little about this mechanism...
We can say that there is a constant struggle between sites and browsers. Sites don't want browsers to save passwords, and browsers want to save all passwords.
There are two main problems that browsers have when working with passwords on websites:
1) Inability to accurately find input elements for username and password. This happens when such elements are not of a conventional "type", and/or when these elements are not part of a "form". The autocomplete="off" attribute may also be a problem.
2) Inability to determine the moment of sending registration data to the server. In this case, the browser has no reason to save anything. Different browsers use a lot of tricks to determine when credentials are sent, and these mechanisms have been improved over the years.

Now, returning specifically to "Pale Moon".
If the browser does not offer to save the password (even though saving passwords is allowed in the settings and in the "Permissions manager" - "about:permissions" page), you can try to help the browser by adding the url, user name and password using the "Classic Password Editor" or similar:
https://addons.palemoon.org/addon/class ... rd-editor/
In many cases, this is enough for the browser to begin prompting you to fill out a password field based on the saved data. For example, this solves the problem for the aliexpress.com.

If the browser cannot detect the username and password fields at all, there is a special mechanism that can help. There is a file that describes non-standard input fields for specific sites:
chrome://passwordmgr/content/recipes.json
You cannot edit this file directly in the browser resources, but you can override the location of this file and create it in your local folder somewhere. To do this, in about:config edit the signon.recipes.path preference and set the file path, for example:
signon.recipes.path = file:///e:/palemoon320500/recipes.json
Next, you can create a file and add fields descriptors for the problematic site there.
You can also set the preference signon.debug = true, which allows you to see useful debugging information in the "Browser Console".

Actually, here is the initial information for experiments.

[Kris_88]

If you do not want to install unnecessary add-ons, you can add a name and password for the site through Scratchpad in the "Environment -> Browser" mode. To enable the "Environment" menu item in the Scratchpad window, set devtools.chrome.enabled = true in about:config.

Code: Select all

Components.utils.import("resource://gre/modules/LoginHelper.jsm");
LoginHelper.maybeImportLogin({
  hostname: "https://www.aliexpress.com",
  username: "your_email_here",
  password: "your_password_here",
  timeCreated: (new Date())
});

[dapgo]

To the topic here, the browser has to "guess" which form field names are used for credentials and which are standard form fields. It can only do so by way of checking the element names and types to have an idea what is a login and what is not, as, by definition, the browser will not know what is processed how on the server-side.
So if you have odd-ball input field names, it'll likely not recognize it as credential fields and thus not store it or use the pwd manager.

As i said before webpages are not following recommendations, probably because they think that it improves security in general terms.
But filling manually is annoying and time consuming, but the bad thing for PM is that as other browsers as Firefox can manage better with this bad login forms, and most end users don't know or don't mind the source of the problem, they just see that something is harder.

If you do not want to install unnecessary add-ons, you can add a name and password for the site through Scratchpad in the "Environment -> Browser" mode. To enable the "Environment" menu item in the Scratchpad window, set devtools.chrome.enabled = true in about:config.

Code: Select all

Components.utils.import("resource://gre/modules/LoginHelper.jsm");
LoginHelper.maybeImportLogin({
  hostname: "https://www.aliexpress.com",
  username: "your_email_here",
  password: "your_password_here",
  timeCreated: (new Date())
});

thanks @Kris_88, your post are very informative
Can it contains fields with wrong type and names like AuthLoginStepUser, AuthLoginStepPassword, j_username,.... ?

I am surprised that others PM users seems not affected whereas I've found in several pages

[Kris_88]

Can it contains fields with wrong type and names like AuthLoginStepUser, AuthLoginStepPassword, j_username,.... ?

This script just adds a username and password to the browser database. But if the browser does not see non-standard input fields (that is, it does not offer filling options when you click on the field), then you can try to describe it for the browser. See my post above which talks about
chrome://passwordmgr/content/recipes.json
Just enter this url into the address bar and you will see the contents of the file that is included in the browser. Several sites are described there and additional ones can be described similarly.

I am surprised that others PM users seems not affected whereas I've found in several pages

https://extranetweb.carrefour.es/Portal ... ientesWeb/
Unfortunately, this site does not respond to me, apparently there is a location limitation. So I can't verify anything for this site.

[dapgo]

I am really surprised that none is confirming that is suffering the explained behavior or requesting that PM can recognize login forms that Firefox is able to recognize and store filled info.

Every few days i found a new page that uses a non standard login form and PM don't ask to store in logins but for most of them Firefox does well.

What is your expected behavior?
Don't support non standard code Or add a workaround to manage it such as copying code/logic from firefox?

[Kris_88]

Every few days i found a new page that uses a non standard login form and PM don't ask to store in logins but for most of them Firefox does well.

I think people rarely register on new sites. "Every few days" is very unusual. For me, it's probably closer to "once a year".

[suzyne]

I don't have Firefox installed so can't compare the effectiveness of Pale Moon verses it, but registering on a new site around once a year sounds unusual to me.

Maybe not every few days, but easily once a week I will store a new site and password pair. Currently I have around 490 passwords associated with websites, and certainly with my online purchasing for the holiday season that number was boosted quite a bit recently. I think it is probably difficult to assume what is typical only based on one's own behaviour?