paypal trouble

Users and developers helping users with generic and technical Pale Moon issues on all operating systems.

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This board is for technical/general usage questions and troubleshooting for the Pale Moon browser only.
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Giraffe
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Re: paypal trouble

Unread post by Giraffe » 2018-06-19, 07:15

Apparently TLS is about to be upgraded to 1.3. I wonder how long before these sites start to demand it.

I've just logged into PP with no hiccups at all.
UA: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:59.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/60.0

I neevr had trouble with PM in there, but changed it for a few sites (non-financial) that did grumble.
Windows 7 Pro 32-bit. Comodo Internet security or Comodo Firewall + Avira Anivirus.

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Night Wing
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Re: paypal trouble

Unread post by Night Wing » 2018-06-19, 09:05

On my last post where I listed two links for "up to date" as well as "security" for Pale Moon, I can get to the PayPal site on my desktop tower computer without any problems with the user agent below:

Code: Select all

Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:3.4) Goanna/20180611 PaleMoon/27.9.3
The user agent above was simply made by changing to "Native" and was made late last night as an experiment just to see if I could get the unsupported browser and/or update your browser prompt from PayPal that some people seem to be getting. I "did not" get the unsupported browser and/or update your browser prompt from PayPal. The user agent above says to PayPal I'm using the linux Pale Moon browser and not another browser such as Firefox, Chrome, etc.

To continue on with the experiment and take it one step further, with the user agent above, I asked my wife to login to her PayPal account using my desktop tower computer with her user name and password and she had no problem in doing so using the "Native" user agent. Once logged in, she could do anything she wanted to do with her PayPal account since all the buttons worked. And when she was finished, she had no problem logging out of her PayPal account.
Linux Mint 21.3 (Virginia) Xfce w/ Linux Pale Moon, Linux Waterfox, Linux SeaLion, Linux Firefox
MX Linux 23.2 (Libretto) Xfce w/ Linux Pale Moon, Linux Waterfox, Linux SeaLion, Linux Firefox
Linux Debian 12.5 (Bookworm) Xfce w/ Linux Pale Moon, Linux Waterfox, Linux SeaLion, Linux Firefox

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therube
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Re: paypal trouble

Unread post by therube » 2018-06-19, 10:03

TLS is about to be upgraded to 1.3. I wonder how long before these sites start to demand it.
TLS 1.3 is already supported (though not enabled, by default).

(Most times) these changes do not happen overnight, & with sites only now starting to specifically looking for 1.2, you've got to figure that time (before 1.3 is the norm) is not an issue.


With no Preference changes, & as expected, PM shows 1.2, which is fine, https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/viewMyClient.html.
Last edited by therube on 2018-06-19, 10:07, edited 1 time in total.

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Moonchild
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Re: paypal trouble

Unread post by Moonchild » 2018-06-19, 21:45

Let's ask Moonchild why he refused an offer from an ex-Mozilla security dev to show how easy Palemoon would be to exploit. He thinks I'm in an Ivory tower so maybe he can climb the ivy up to the top and explain why such an offer would be refused in return for a small donation to a charity of his choice?
I have never refused any such offer. I'm also pretty certain if there was an easy way to exploit Pale Moon, the evangelists in the MozillaZine corner of the web would not let this opportunity pass them by to shout from every rooftop or syndicate through whatever techbabble sites they are involved in to try and destroy this project.
If you or anyone else finds a way to exploit Pale Moon, by all means, do the right thing and let me know through a secure channel. I have always held that door wide open.
As some people in the IT security branch (e.g. Berk Cem Göksel just this month) have seen I am very quick to respond to any potential vulnerability if presented to me in an industry-standard way (i.e.: secure communication, PoC provided, and preferably a brief analysis marking it as a potential vulnerability, meaning an explanation why the PoC is considered a potential security issue).
Use Palemoon for financial sites at your own risk.
To end this stupidity once and for all I have popped the question to PayPal's technical and legal department to get a straight answer to this argument in our community instigated by you. Guess what the answer was? I'll quote them; they even marked it in bold in their reply:

Transactions are secured through PayPal by technical means, and as such has nothing to do with what browser is used. The technical support that PayPal offers is in relation to the programming of check-outs and the like.

As long as the browser supports the programming language that PayPal uses, there is no issue.


This unambiguously answers the question about liability. Liability is subject to the technical means by which the transactions are secured, and not subject to which web client is in use. It is solely the financial sites' responsibility to secure these transactions, as I've been saying all along.
Technical support and "supported browsers", as clearly stated, is purely related to the implementation of check-outs and the public web portion of such secured transactions, and is completely separate from the security of those transactions. E.g. if a shopping cart or check-out doesn't work in Pale Moon, you're on your own. But if it does, then the responsibility of the actual financial transaction and security thereof is and remains with the financial institution.
Last edited by Moonchild on 2018-06-20, 22:58, edited 3 times in total.
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LigH1L
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Re: paypal trouble

Unread post by LigH1L » 2018-06-20, 12:56

I was led to the PayPal FAQ page:

How do I check and update my web browser?

There is a link to a minimalistic browser check:
Click here to test your browser.
  • If you see a message that says: “PayPal_Connection_OK” your browser is up-to-date and no further action is needed.
  • If you have an outdated browser you’ll see this message: “ERROR! Connection is using TLS version lesser than 1.2. Please use TLS1.2”.
https://tlstest.paypal.com/ returns for Pale Moon 27.9.3 (without specific customizations), as well as for Basilisk 2018.06.01:
PayPal_Connection_OK
8-) Questions?

As long as this is the relevant check, and not a superfluous User Agent string analysis, we are all fine. NO PANIC
Last edited by LigH1L on 2018-06-20, 12:58, edited 1 time in total.
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Pallid Planetoid
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Re: paypal trouble

Unread post by Pallid Planetoid » 2018-06-20, 15:07

Yep -- tried the test you linked above myself and got: "PayPal_Connection_OK".... perhaps we can say the issue is settled? (that is as far as PayPal is concerned).
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