Netflix and Facebook

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Richvideo

Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Richvideo » 2017-01-07, 21:49

CharmCityCrab wrote:
Gandalfdjh wrote: Also Moonchild has a company called Moonchild Productions, which I am sure has a contact page.
moonchild.prods@gmail.com

I assume I can share this because it's posted publicly on his website here:

http://www.moonchildproductions.info/contact/

I also want to include the disclaimer, which is:

"For support questions for the Pale Moon web browser, please don't use the information on this page, but go to the Pale Moon forum instead."

This is something I looked up purely to help Rich facilitate the thing with Netflix. Please don't use it for other purposes.
CharmCityCrab thank you for that, I had already found it once Gandalfdjh pointed me in that direction. In my previous post I explained how I hoped MC would proceed which will allow me to remove myself as the middleman

I will consider forwarding MC's email to Sam Pan if MC totally refuses to make first contact with him but I really would like to stop being the relay in this conversation at this point.

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by CharmCityCrab » 2017-01-10, 02:51

Richvideo wrote:
CharmCityCrab wrote:
Gandalfdjh wrote: Also Moonchild has a company called Moonchild Productions, which I am sure has a contact page.
moonchild.prods@gmail.com

I assume I can share this because it's posted publicly on his website here:

http://www.moonchildproductions.info/contact/

I also want to include the disclaimer, which is:

"For support questions for the Pale Moon web browser, please don't use the information on this page, but go to the Pale Moon forum instead."

This is something I looked up purely to help Rich facilitate the thing with Netflix. Please don't use it for other purposes.
CharmCityCrab thank you for that, I had already found it once Gandalfdjh pointed me in that direction. In my previous post I explained how I hoped MC would proceed which will allow me to remove myself as the middleman

I will consider forwarding MC's email to Sam Pan if MC totally refuses to make first contact with him but I really would like to stop being the relay in this conversation at this point.
If you really don't want to do it, I'd be willing to forward MoonChild's email address to the Netflix guy if you can provide me the Netflix guy's email address. I'd hate to see the possibility of making the browser and Netflix work better together get lost because you and MC are having a disagreement about who should email who. :) I can email the guy and then he can email MC, and that should make everyone happy, right?

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by cartel » 2017-01-10, 12:34

Richvideo wrote:
Facebook-If I open a photo or video link in a new tab the page endlessly refreshes
^^this
ImageImage

Richvideo

Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Richvideo » 2017-01-10, 15:08

cartel wrote:
Richvideo wrote:
Facebook-If I open a photo or video link in a new tab the page endlessly refreshes
^^this

I had luck fixing that by
Using this useragent:

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Trident/7.0; rv:11.0) Gecko/20160101 PaleMoon/27.0.3 like Gecko

to

general.useragent.override.facebook.com
general.useragent.override.fbcdn.com
general.useragent.override.fbcdn.net

and the issue immediately went away.

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Moonraker » 2017-01-10, 18:43

Richvideo wrote:
cartel wrote:
Richvideo wrote:
Facebook-If I open a photo or video link in a new tab the page endlessly refreshes
^^this

I had luck fixing that by
Using this useragent:

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Trident/7.0; rv:11.0) Gecko/20160101 PaleMoon/27.0.3 like Gecko

to

general.useragent.override.facebook.com
general.useragent.override.fbcdn.com
general.useragent.override.fbcdn.net

and the issue immediately went away.
How would i implement those overrides please.?
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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by back2themoon » 2017-01-10, 20:20

Moonraker wrote:How would i implement those overrides please.?
https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.ph ... 60#p102295
Safe Mode / clean profile info: Help/Restart in Safe Mode
Information to include when asking for support - How to apply user agent overrides
How to download videos

Windows 10 Pro • Pale Moon x64 • Interlink x86 • Emsisoft Anti-Malware

Richvideo

Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Richvideo » 2017-01-11, 16:09

CharmCityCrab wrote:
Richvideo wrote:
CharmCityCrab wrote:
Gandalfdjh wrote: Also Moonchild has a company called Moonchild Productions, which I am sure has a contact page.
moonchild.prods@gmail.com

I assume I can share this because it's posted publicly on his website here:

http://www.moonchildproductions.info/contact/

I also want to include the disclaimer, which is:

"For support questions for the Pale Moon web browser, please don't use the information on this page, but go to the Pale Moon forum instead."

This is something I looked up purely to help Rich facilitate the thing with Netflix. Please don't use it for other purposes.
CharmCityCrab thank you for that, I had already found it once Gandalfdjh pointed me in that direction. In my previous post I explained how I hoped MC would proceed which will allow me to remove myself as the middleman

I will consider forwarding MC's email to Sam Pan if MC totally refuses to make first contact with him but I really would like to stop being the relay in this conversation at this point.
If you really don't want to do it, I'd be willing to forward MoonChild's email address to the Netflix guy if you can provide me the Netflix guy's email address. I'd hate to see the possibility of making the browser and Netflix work better together get lost because you and MC are having a disagreement about who should email who. :) I can email the guy and then he can email MC, and that should make everyone happy, right?
Thank you for the offer of help CharmCityCrab Sam Pan in his email clearly stated that he would rather not have a relayed conversation with a middleman I don't think adding another person into the mix is going to make Sam more willing to work with us.
If either of us wrote him we would have to explain to Sam that MC will not contact you first because he seems insulted that Neil Hunt did not respond to him and unless you find that email that MC sent him he will not be contacting anyone, how do you think that's going to play over at Netflix?

The least problematic way to move forward that could lead to the desired results we want would be MC sending that email off to Sam Pan as soon as possible.Does anyone disagree with that,I don't think my logic is off?

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by CharmCityCrab » 2017-01-12, 04:25

Richvideo wrote: Thank you for the offer of help CharmCityCrab Sam Pan in his email clearly stated that he would rather not have a relayed conversation with a middleman I don't think adding another person into the mix is going to make Sam more willing to work with us.
If either of us wrote him we would have to explain to Sam that MC will not contact you first because he seems insulted that Neil Hunt did not respond to him and unless you find that email that MC sent him he will not be contacting anyone, how do you think that's going to play over at Netflix?

The least problematic way to move forward that could lead to the desired results we want would be MC sending that email off to Sam Pan as soon as possible.Does anyone disagree with that,I don't think my logic is off?
I understand your point about the path of least resistance, but it's worth keeping mind that the gentleman who works for Netflix is not intrinsically a more important fellow than MoonChild is. You're respecting Mr. Pan's preferences, so it makes sense to respect MoonChild's preferences as well. Just because MoonChild makes himself accessible doesn't mean that his time isn't valuable and that his preferences aren't important. It's very nice of MoonChild to make himself this available, it's not an indicator of lack of status- a lot of people with smaller browser user bases than he has do not really communicate as much as he does- it's a value added feature he offers because he's a nice guy who cares about the people who use his browser.

I always try to imagine, or at least my best practice is to try to imagine (Can't say I always live up to this), what it might be like from the perspective of other people. MoonChild created and maintains a browser that works with millions of sites and has a ton of responsibilities to keep the browser going and working with the Internet in general. If he devoted a ton of time to every individual site, he'd have to work 1000 hour days, which obviously is impossible, because there are only 24 hours in a day. Still, he recognizes that some sites are so widely used and so important to some users that he is willing to give them individual time and attention even though probably from his perspective he's built a browser that's easy to work with, that complies with web standards, and that includes all the modern features; and probably feels that the people running websites should be in charge of making sure their site works with his browser and not the other way around, as long as the browser works with the web in general (Which it does). But he makes the effort anyway to reach out to some of those sites and see what he can work out anyway- in this case, he's done so several times in several different ways, and it's been ignored or rebuffed.

He must feel like Charlie Brown feels when Lucy brings out the football in Peanuts cartoons and promises that this one time, unlike all the other times, Lucy won't pull the football away at the last minute and make Charlie Brown fall on his rear end instead of allowing him to kick the football. From his perspective, how many times is he supposed to call and email people to get this one site working on the browser? He probably feels like this email would be ignored, too, and then someone would come along with another lead and ask him to write another email next week or something, and rinse and repeat.

What is unfortunate about this is that Netflix is an important site to a lot of people, and it'd be great if Pale Moon and Netflix could work together to fix any compatibility issues. However, I get where MoonChild is coming from here. He's spent a lot of time with this and people have ignored his emails or rebuffed him and he doesn't want to waste more time when he's only got a limited amount of it and could be using it to better the browser and fix other situations.

I can understand why you'd want him to email the guy, though, because you talked to the guy and think the guy will listen to MoonChild and we could finally get this done. But, remember, you're coming into it late. MoonChild has probably been trying to do something about this for months or years and is likely fed up.

I hope that this situation resolves itself at some point. But it may be time for Netflix to take some initiative here and respond to MoonChild's emails. I mean, they've got a lot of paying customers, myself included, who would like to be able to do things like reorder their queue (Or MyList feature) using the Pale Moon web browser. I pay Netflix, I don't pay Pale Moon. Really, Netflix should be the ones taking the lead in trying to make sure things work for their paying customers on the browser of their choice. I understand why Netflix might feel the need to mostly limit their support to the 4 or 5 biggest browsers, but Pale Moon isn't *that* far down there on the list. It's got half a million users, which granted is a small fraction of the big four or five, but it might be just after that- there really aren't many browsers with market shares in the hundreds of thousands after you get past Internet Explorer, Edge, Chrome, Firefox, Safari, and Opera. Pale Moon could easily be #7 in the world.

I hope this situation works out, but I don't blame MoonChild for it not being worked out. If MoonChild won't send the email, it sounds like your choice is to give up or to send the other guy MoonChild's email address. I don't know any other options right now. That's what you've got in front of you.

Richvideo

Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Richvideo » 2017-01-12, 06:11

CharmCityCrab wrote:
Richvideo wrote: Thank you for the offer of help CharmCityCrab Sam Pan in his email clearly stated that he would rather not have a relayed conversation with a middleman I don't think adding another person into the mix is going to make Sam more willing to work with us.
If either of us wrote him we would have to explain to Sam that MC will not contact you first because he seems insulted that Neil Hunt did not respond to him and unless you find that email that MC sent him he will not be contacting anyone, how do you think that's going to play over at Netflix?

The least problematic way to move forward that could lead to the desired results we want would be MC sending that email off to Sam Pan as soon as possible.Does anyone disagree with that,I don't think my logic is off?
I understand your point about the path of least resistance, but it's worth keeping mind that the gentleman who works for Netflix is not intrinsically a more important fellow than MoonChild is. You're respecting Mr. Pan's preferences, so it makes sense to respect MoonChild's preferences as well. Just because MoonChild makes himself accessible doesn't mean that his time isn't valuable and that his preferences aren't important. It's very nice of MoonChild to make himself this available, it's not an indicator of lack of status- a lot of people with smaller browser user bases than he has do not really communicate as much as he does- it's a value added feature he offers because he's a nice guy who cares about the people who use his browser.

I always try to imagine, or at least my best practice is to try to imagine (Can't say I always live up to this), what it might be like from the perspective of other people. MoonChild created and maintains a browser that works with millions of sites and has a ton of responsibilities to keep the browser going and working with the Internet in general. If he devoted a ton of time to every individual site, he'd have to work 1000 hour days, which obviously is impossible, because there are only 24 hours in a day. Still, he recognizes that some sites are so widely used and so important to some users that he is willing to give them individual time and attention even though probably from his perspective he's built a browser that's easy to work with, that complies with web standards, and that includes all the modern features; and probably feels that the people running websites should be in charge of making sure their site works with his browser and not the other way around, as long as the browser works with the web in general (Which it does). But he makes the effort anyway to reach out to some of those sites and see what he can work out anyway- in this case, he's done so several times in several different ways, and it's been ignored or rebuffed.

He must feel like Charlie Brown feels when Lucy brings out the football in Peanuts cartoons and promises that this one time, unlike all the other times, Lucy won't pull the football away at the last minute and make Charlie Brown fall on his rear end instead of allowing him to kick the football. From his perspective, how many times is he supposed to call and email people to get this one site working on the browser? He probably feels like this email would be ignored, too, and then someone would come along with another lead and ask him to write another email next week or something, and rinse and repeat.

What is unfortunate about this is that Netflix is an important site to a lot of people, and it'd be great if Pale Moon and Netflix could work together to fix any compatibility issues. However, I get where MoonChild is coming from here. He's spent a lot of time with this and people have ignored his emails or rebuffed him and he doesn't want to waste more time when he's only got a limited amount of it and could be using it to better the browser and fix other situations.

I can understand why you'd want him to email the guy, though, because you talked to the guy and think the guy will listen to MoonChild and we could finally get this done. But, remember, you're coming into it late. MoonChild has probably been trying to do something about this for months or years and is likely fed up.

I hope that this situation resolves itself at some point. But it may be time for Netflix to take some initiative here and respond to MoonChild's emails. I mean, they've got a lot of paying customers, myself included, who would like to be able to do things like reorder their queue (Or MyList feature) using the Pale Moon web browser. I pay Netflix, I don't pay Pale Moon. Really, Netflix should be the ones taking the lead in trying to make sure things work for their paying customers on the browser of their choice. I understand why Netflix might feel the need to mostly limit their support to the 4 or 5 biggest browsers, but Pale Moon isn't *that* far down there on the list. It's got half a million users, which granted is a small fraction of the big four or five, but it might be just after that- there really aren't many browsers with market shares in the hundreds of thousands after you get past Internet Explorer, Edge, Chrome, Firefox, Safari, and Opera. Pale Moon could easily be #7 in the world.

I hope this situation works out, but I don't blame MoonChild for it not being worked out. If MoonChild won't send the email, it sounds like your choice is to give up or to send the other guy MoonChild's email address. I don't know any other options right now. That's what you've got in front of you.
If MC told me that he contacted Neil Hunt or Sam Pan way before I did and received no response I would agree with what you are saying but it seems like he dealt with some call center flunkies that had no idea what he was asking for, he mentioned he wrote a letter to them, honestly in today's corporate world who reads letters other than the government?
I have the guy who is in charge of the Netflix UI on the line and he won't deal with him because some call center flunkies did not help him in the past c'mon?
You said
"Really, Netflix should be the ones taking the lead in trying to make sure things work for their paying customer..."
They did, I brought the issues to their attention as a customer and they were fairly responsiveness as corporations go and dealt with me regardless that I bypassed the usual support channels and went right to the head.

Thanks for your insights CharmCityCrab MoonChild's work of course is appreciated as well as any other developers that assist him when things need fixing. I thought that I saw postings from MC asking us to contact these companies and demand that they expand what browsers that they cater to...I could be mistaken but I thought that I saw a posting like that somewhere....So I was proactive and did that, I don't think that any PM user has spoken directly with a big corporate head about Pale Moon and had them say "sure how can I help" so I feel that this a unique situation --Feel free to chime in PM users if I am wrong about that, I would like to hear your about your experiences.

kizo07

Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by kizo07 » 2017-01-12, 23:42

Richvideo wrote:Feel free
This is not trial against somebody, but looks like.
I have read all 'papers' once again, found some 'holes', and thinking...
If I'm in MoonChild's position, I'd do exactly the same.
If I'm in Sam Pan position, I would contacted PM/MoonChild (if nothing else, asked my people for contact info) and do My job.
If I'm Sam Pan's boss and heard about 'this case', I'd call Sam Pan to my office and at least, had a long conversation with him.
If I'm your boss, probably I would say 'Richie boy, you are a nice person, you are dynamic and proactive, you working a lot...but It's not enough, please take a break. I need to find some other person to finish the job.'

Richvideo

Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Richvideo » 2017-01-13, 00:28

kizo07 wrote:
Richvideo wrote:Feel free
This is not trial against somebody, but looks like.
I have read all 'papers' once again, found some 'holes', and thinking...
If I'm in MoonChild's position, I'd do exactly the same.
If I'm in Sam Pan position, I would contacted PM/MoonChild (if nothing else, asked my people for contact info) and do My job.
If I'm Sam Pan's boss and heard about 'this case', I'd call Sam Pan to my office and at least, had a long conversation with him.
If I'm your boss, probably I would say 'Richie boy, you are a nice person, you are dynamic and proactive, you working a lot...but It's not enough, please take a break. I need to find some other person to finish the job.'
Yeah that is not my experience of how things work in the corporate world and I am not going to draw a picture for you anymore of how this actually went down because something is getting lost in the translation I assume English is not your first language.

I am off now to contact Sam and try to figure out a way to get him to contact MC without him pressing me to tell him why MC won't contact him first which could possibly end any chance of a relationship with Netflix's management.
I do hope that Sam just goes forward and contacts him once I pass him MoonChild's email without him asking me to tell MC to reach out to him first again because it is game over at that point and good luck reverse engineering fixes from now on

Andrew Gilbertson

Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Andrew Gilbertson » 2017-01-13, 22:53

Richvideo wrote: I do hope that Sam just goes forward and contacts him once I pass him MoonChild's email without him asking me to tell MC to reach out to him first again because it is game over at that point and good luck reverse engineering fixes from now on
Could you maybe use the CC: field in your e-mail so that instead of acting as a relay between the two of them, they can start communicating directly with each other immediately?

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by JodyThornton » 2017-01-14, 14:33

Richvideo wrote:Yeah that is not my experience of how things work in the corporate world and I am not going to draw a picture for you anymore of how this actually went down because something is getting lost in the translation I assume English is not your first language.

I am off now to contact Sam and try to figure out a way to get him to contact MC without him pressing me to tell him why MC won't contact him first which could possibly end any chance of a relationship with Netflix's management.
I do hope that Sam just goes forward and contacts him once I pass him MoonChild's email without him asking me to tell MC to reach out to him first again because it is game over at that point and good luck reverse engineering fixes from now on
I have to agree this becoming an impossible situation, and Moonchild should be the one to just plain kowtow to Netflix. Ego and principle may dictate otherwise, but Netflix has no interest in securing Pale Moon's future. Why should it? The world's not fair. Netflix is helping kill off MAJOR TV networks as we speak. Why would it care about a small browser creator?

However, the reality is Moonchild should care about Netflix not working to spec. If you're going to let principle get in the way of that, how do you expect to grow your browser's market share.

kizo07

Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by kizo07 » 2017-01-14, 15:18

I think it's important not to point out a direction either for Moonchild or Netflix...or anyone.
Primarily for us, are to understand what they are doing, if we can. If we can't, we should just be not 'worried' and be a bit patient and wait?
Can we get to it?

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Sajadi » 2017-01-14, 17:05

JodyThornton wrote:If you're going to let principle get in the way of that, how do you expect to grow your browser's market share.
Now this i find a bit of a dangerous statement. Going that way would also have meant to discard Pale Moon customization and go Australis only way to make sure almost all extensions work so that every extension user is happy, also to add Webextension and discard XUL.

Going with the mass opinion would result just into another limited "Firefox becoming a Chrome similar copy " kind of browser.

Principles are often much more valueable than just going with the opinion of the mass! If the mass not likes that, fine for me. Also other people's opinion is of value. And if one software does not fit one's need, then there are enough options out there which fit someone's need better.

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Moonchild » 2017-01-18, 13:30

For the record, I did send an e-mail to the address given to me by Rich for Sam Pan, to try one last time to move forward.

Let's see if he proves me wrong.
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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by rabnbeinn » 2017-01-18, 16:28

Moonchild wrote:For the record, I did send an e-mail to the address given to me by Rich for Sam Pan, to try one last time to move forward.

Let's see if he proves me wrong.
Lets hope that Sam Pan comes good and this issue hopefully gets resolved. :thumbup:

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by Moonraker » 2017-01-18, 18:40

JodyThornton wrote:
Richvideo wrote:Yeah that is not my experience of how things work in the corporate world and I am not going to draw a picture for you anymore of how this actually went down because something is getting lost in the translation I assume English is not your first language.

I am off now to contact Sam and try to figure out a way to get him to contact MC without him pressing me to tell him why MC won't contact him first which could possibly end any chance of a relationship with Netflix's management.
I do hope that Sam just goes forward and contacts him once I pass him MoonChild's email without him asking me to tell MC to reach out to him first again because it is game over at that point and good luck reverse engineering fixes from now on
I have to agree this becoming an impossible situation, and Moonchild should be the one to just plain kowtow to Netflix. Ego and principle may dictate otherwise, but Netflix has no interest in securing Pale Moon's future. Why should it? The world's not fair. Netflix is helping kill off MAJOR TV networks as we speak. Why would it care about a small browser creator?

However, the reality is Moonchild should care about Netflix not working to spec. If you're going to let principle get in the way of that, how do you expect to grow your browser's market share.
And why would the secure future of a browser rely on one website...?
The idea is ludicrous and i personally dont use netflix and dont give a hoot if netflix supports it or not. :D
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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by half-moon » 2017-01-18, 22:28

Moonraker wrote:And why would the secure future of a browser rely on one website...?
The idea is ludicrous and i personally dont use netflix and dont give a hoot if netflix supports it or not. :D
Agreed.

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Re: Netflix and Facebook

Unread post by JodyThornton » 2017-01-19, 00:04

half-moon wrote:
Moonraker wrote:And why would the secure future of a browser rely on one website...?
The idea is ludicrous and i personally dont use netflix and dont give a hoot if netflix supports it or not. :D
Agreed.
That's the issue right there. You are basing your opinion on your own use (not how prospective users might interact with the browser). You're acting as "Well if it doesn't affect me, it should be good enough for everyone else." Guess what, I also don't use Netflix, but I know a lot of other people do. Thus, I don't make myself sound like a luddite in the process. Someone who considers themselves to be an aware and in touch person in 2017 recognizes the impact of Netflix.

And anyone who uses a web browser would expect it to work to spec. Now I know Moonchild asked us to simmer down on these sorts of threads. But these last two posts demonstrate the problem here. If you care about Pale Moon's future, you should want this feature to work. Otherwise, how then would you recommend I try to steer my friends into using Pale Moon? What would you have me say to them?

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