The Australis mega-thread

[access2godzilla]

PM25 doesn't build on older gcc versions anymore and breaks hard

Could you state which versions of gcc it causes issues on? It works fine on 4.7.*, which is what I (and probably you and cyansmoker too) use.

[Moonchild]

I don't know which version specifically, and I don't have time to find out by doing a trial and error run.

Previously I built with gcc 4.4, since that is what comes with the OS I'm building on. Running into the issue I switched to 4.7 which builds fine. So it's somewhere in-between those two, and apparently has something to do with the way the "auto" typedef, the statement "static_cast" or pointers in general are handled.

[Ryrynz]

Depends on how the RCs pan out. Already had an issue that PM25 doesn't build on older gcc versions anymore and breaks hard.
And FYI: the only reason I'm finalizing right now is sec issues and I don't want to make another point release on 24.7 - too far along the dev track now to break off and shift focus for that.

Fair enough. Why attempt to maintain compatibility with old GCC versions? It's free, everyone should be running the latest 4.9.1

[Moonchild]

Fair enough. Why attempt to maintain compatibility with old GCC versions? It's free, everyone should be running the latest 4.9.1

There's no guarantees that the source code builds without issues when switching compiler versions. And some operating systems simply don't come with a later version (e.g. CentOS 6.5 comes with gcc 4.4, not later)

[access2godzilla]

some operating systems simply don't come with a later version (e.g. CentOS 6.5 comes with gcc 4.4, not later)

You can always get later versions of compilers in CentOS from devtool(set)-*. gcc 4.7 should be available in devtools-1.1 and 4.8 in devtools-2.

It's free, everyone should be running the latest 4.9.1

I've had a taste of what happens with compiler upgrades like that: a switch to 4.7.2->4.8 broke PNG decoding. I certainly wouldn't advise that.

[Moonchild]

Off-topic:

You can always get later versions of compilers in CentOS from devtool(set)-*.

That it's available from a third-party (and obscure) repo still doesn't change the fact that it doesn't come with the OS.

[minimal-m]

Is today the last day Mozilla is supporting ESR 24?

[Night Wing]

Is today the last day Mozilla is supporting ESR 24?

I think so. We'll have to wait a few more hours to be sure since the regular stable of version of Firefox 33 is supposed to be released today.

I just checked Mozilla's ESR site before I came here and the old 24 ESR version is still there.

https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/o ... tions/all/

[Moonchild]

The Firefox for organizations page lists Firefox ESR31 now, so yes, it's officially EoL for ESR24; not that it's been updated in the last cycle in any way, anyway, and only minimally since 31 debuted.

So yes, Organizations are now pushed to Australis as well. I hope the IT department suicides are kept to a minimum.

[New Tobin Paradigm]

The Firefox for organizations page lists Firefox ESR31 now, so yes, it's officially EoL for ESR24; not that it's been updated in the last cycle in any way, anyway, and only minimally since 31 debuted.

So yes, Organizations are now pushed to Australis as well. I hope the IT department suicides are kept to a minimum.

Firefox ESR24 got the nss update and that is about it. Pale Moon 25.x continued to get more security updates that ESR24 did not get.

Off-topic:
This thread I think is still listed as my most active in thread lol

[Moonchild]

Also, for the people really "into" Australis -- did you know that "Pale Moon Australis" is very much an option if you want it?

For example, a quick test setup I did:

palemoon-australis.png

With some additional tweaking (e.g. removing the appmenu and replacing it with a "hamburger" access button on the nav toolbar) you can have it polished, and more functional than Firefox's actual thing ;P

[fufsgfen]

Thanks Moonchild, now I will have nightmares of Palemoon switching to that ugly 'modern' looks

[11ryanc]

This is more like it, for me:
Clean, logical, classic

[Sajadi]

The problem with Australis is not actually the design, it is the lack of internal choices which have been put into external developers hands! The outcry and all the problems would not have appeared if users would have been able to turn around some switches in about:config to get their customization features back

[11ryanc]

The problem with Australis is not actually the design, it is the lack of internal choices which have been put into external developers hands! The outcry and all the problems would not have appeared if users would have been able to turn around some switches in about:config to get their customization features back

Agreed. I don't understand why Mozilla would go this way, a simple new (default) redesign could have been perfectly sufficient if they really wanted to be a "Chrome Wannabe" by design. They just about cut away everything a devout Mozilla user would want to have. And truthfully, I can't say it doesn't look nice. Just way too dumbed down for my usage, that's why I got sick of Chrome.

[Moonchild]

My poke at Australis on Pale Moon was mostly just to show that all this stripping down of the browser for the "UI refesh" really wasn't needed. It could already be done on the existing UI with a theme! Make a new default theme, maybe add some other XUL UI code, and you'd be done - none of this stripping down and crippling of features.

On top of that, the front-end isn't the only part that suffered from having Australis on it. The corruption runs much deeper, and despite the hard work of a number of Mozilla core developers trying to keep things together, it's just been spiraling down to a less stable, more leaky whole. The current release channel browser has many issues, ranging from crashing, having terrible garbage collection in javascript and slow page access to continued rendering problems that aren't being solved. Is Australis to blame? Yes, both directly (by requiring a redesign of the "middleware" layer in the browser) and indirectly (by having skilful developers leave the company and browser development).

[Sajadi]

And all for Mozilla's hunger for reaching out with this dumbification and simplification for a higher number of unexperienced and less demanding not power users or higher experienced users users - aka the Chrome userbase...

Shows one thing, if decisions are made trough the money-purse instead of actually developing for the benefit of the whole userbase, things hardly are able to improve!

[Night Wing]

Ever since Mozilla made Australis the default UI in Firefox 29, which was released on May 29th of 2014, Firefox has been in a nose dive with regards to desktop market share. It's down to (13.26%).

http://www.netmarketshare.com/browser-m ... pcustomb=0

I'm sure Australis isn't the sole reason why Firefox is declining at such a rapid rate, but since Australis has been out for 6 months now, it's clear the UI change by Mozilla hasn't been liked by many users (me included) and it sure hasn't helped Firefox regain market share.

[11ryanc]

Ever since Mozilla made Australis the default UI in Firefox 29, which was released on May 29th of 2014, Firefox has been in a nose dive with regards to desktop market share. It's down to (13.26%).

http://www.netmarketshare.com/browser-m ... pcustomb=0

I'm sure Australis isn't the sole reason why Firefox is declining at such a rapid rate, but since Australis has been out for 6 months now, it's clear the UI change by Mozilla hasn't been liked by many users (me included) and it sure hasn't helped Firefox regain market share.

Mozilla's pattern: *Looses Firefox users, gains Chrome users*.

[TheRealShane]

I've had Firefox ESR as a rarely-used back-up browser for a few months. I just opened it to update the add-ons and got the notification of a security update - to FF31. So now ESR is Australis.

Oh well. Have to look for a new back-up browser. In Windows, anyway. I think, actually, loathe as I am to say it, I think that is likely to be Internet Explorer: if you hate them all, might as well use the one that's already there! Likewise in Mint KDE, I'll stick with Konqueror.

At least, as I understand it, Pale Moon is independent of the FF ESR codebase.

Shane